Mortgages are skyrocketing, rents keep increasing, two thirds of young Australians believe they will never own a home and it’s hard to blame them.

The housing unaffordability crisis is the greatest issue facing Australia. Australians want to have their hard work and savings rewarded. They want a place to call their own and a place they can stay to raise a family.

The median house price in Brisbane is 10 times the median income.[1] In Brisbane it would take the average income 13 years just to save a deposit.

Rents are also rising on the back of a record low national vacancy rate of 1%.[2] Experts consider a 3% vacancy rate to be tight, a national average of 1% is an absolute crisis.

Right now, many Australians simply cannot afford a roof over their head.

Like any market there are two things and two things only that affect housing prices: supply and demand. Decades of successive governments have mismanaged both sides of the equation.

This is how One Nation would properly manage our economy and deliver cheaper houses and cheaper rent:

Cut overseas arrivals, ban foreign ownership, increase supply and stop pumping up profits for the Big Banks.

Cut the flood of overseas arrivals

In the short term, we need to stop pouring fuel on the fire. A huge amount of overseas arrivals are driving unsustainable demand.

Excluding tourists and short stay visitors, there are currently 2.3 million visa holders in the country likely to need housing.[3]

These working visa holders, students and others are putting enormous strain on the rental market, fighting Australians for a roof over their head and driving up rent prices.

The arrivals that can afford it are also buying houses, pushing up prices even higher.

The Albanese Labor government issued a record 670,000 student visas in one year when we only have 100,000 dedicated student accommodation beds.

In addition to these 2.3 million visa holders likely to need housing, there are roughly 400,000 tourist and other visa holders in the country.

While tourism is good for Australia, in the middle of our rental shortage this high demand is motivating owners to take their properties out of the rental pool and convert them to lucrative, full-time AirBnBs.

That means less rental supply for people needing a place to live and higher rents.

2.7 million visa holders, more than 10% of Australia’s population, are in the country right now fighting Australians for a roof over their head.

The country cannot sustain this level of overseas arrivals. It must be cut to take immediate pressure off housing availability and affordability.

Why haven’t we cut arrivals already?

Powerful lobby groups who rely on high immigration have been able to falsely label anyone who talks about this problem as “racist”.

Talking about reasonable levels of immigration is about securing a prosperous future for all Australians, including those who come to the country. Ruining our economy is a bad outcome for immigrants as well.

As the problem gets even worse, even mainstream media is now being forced to acknowledge the huge negative effects Australia is seeing from an unsustainable amount of arrivals.

The biggest winners from high house prices and big immigration are the big banks and multinational corporations relying on cheap labour.

Mortgages are so profitable for banks that they have become over-reliant on housing prices.

The ratio of borrowing for mortgages versus borrowing for business has skyrocketed to more than 200%, up from less than 40% in 1990.[3A]

That means the Big Banks are less diversified and will lose more money if housing becomes affordable.

As the Reserve Bank raises interest rates, the big banks pass that on at up to 7%, yet the banks borrowed long term funds from the RBA at just 0.1%.

They’re pocketing the huge difference leading to record-breaking profits.

There is billions of dollars at stake for the banks and other big businesses if housing became more affordable. The questions have to be asked whether government is putting the profits of greedy banks and multinational corporations ahead of Australians having affordable housing.

One Nation would never repeat the mistakes of the COVID period, where the Reserve Bank was allowed to create $500 billion out of thin air.[4]

That led to the inflation the Reserve Bank is now trying to fight and the tool it uses to do that is sending mortgage holders broke.

This only pumps up the big banks profits.

Ban Foreign Ownership

Finally, on the demand side solutions, we need to ban foreign ownership of Australian assets.

The government has no idea exactly how bad foreign purchases are.[5] A single real estate agent in Sydney sold $135 million in property to Chinese buyers in just six months.[6]

Australians can’t own a house in China, so why should we let foreign citizens buy property here?

Australian property is also a hotbed for suspected money laundering, with much of this happening in foreign connected purchases.[7]

We need to ban foreign ownership of Australian homes to decrease demand and give Australians a shot at owning their own home.

Let tradies build homes

On the supply side, government needs to get out of the way with their restrictive building codes, green land restrictions and a spider web of employment law.

Our tradies know how to build homes. Government just needs to get out of the way and let them build.

While increasing supply is an important part, it is important to note that supply can only be increased so much in the face of overwhelming demand, fuelled by overseas arrivals and foreign purchasers.

Australia has typically built homes at nearly the fastest rate in the world, fourth out of all OECD countries.[8]

Supply chain issues, high interest rates and rising construction insolvencies mean its very unlikely we will be able to easily build even more supply than the high amount we already do.[9]

Looking at how Australia punches above its weight in building houses and increasing supply already, it’s clear the biggest issue we have to fix is the demand side currently driven by overseas arrivals.[10]

One Nation would make home ownership a reality for Australians

A home is a castle.

The family unit and our society flourish when we have stable places to build our lives and raise families.

Decades of indifferent governments from both sides of politics have ruined this dream for many.

Only One Nation has the guts to make the decisions that will make the dream of home ownership a reality for all Australians.

Affordable houses, lower affordable rents and a flourishing economy is all possible under One Nation.


[1] Housing unaffordability hits grim new peak (afr.com)

[2] The Latest Rental Vacancy Rates around Australia (archive.is)

[3] Tarric Brooker aka Avid Commentator 🇦🇺 on X: “A new all time high for the number of temporary visa holders in Australia likely to require some form of housing.https://t.co/6NQ8HXu3i4” / X (archive.is)

[3A] (57) Tarric Brooker aka Avid Commentator 🇦🇺 on X: “Why Australia’s productivity growth is sub par when not being juiced by a resources boom or an expansion of household debt summed up in one chart. Businesses have gone from a peak of 74% of bank lending to 34% today. All that capital is flowing into housing instead. https://t.co/ZfyJMvAK7y” / X (twitter.com)

[4] RBA creates inflation by printing money out of thin air – Malcolm Roberts (malcolmrobertsqld.com.au)

[5] Housing ‘scandal’: Foreigners buy twice as many homes as recorded (archive.is)

[6] Chinese millionaires snap up Australian properties in Toorak, Armadale, Malvern, Hawkthorne and Kooyong | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site (archive.is)

[7] No questions asked: money laundering thrives in Australia because of professionals willing to facilitate it | Crime – Australia | The Guardian (archive.is)

[8] [Title] (oecd.org)

[9] ASIC data shows insolvencies in the building and construction industry have hit pre-Covid levels | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site

[10] Why more supply will never fix the housing market – MacroBusiness

China uses Australian coal to make cheap power and products which we then buy back off them, even subsidising them in the case of wind turbines and solar panels. This madness has to stop.

The Big 4 banks have been ripping Australians off for decades. Taking all the profits, they’re leaving regional communities in the dust, closing branches and strangling small business capital. We need a people’s bank in Australia.

I had the pleasure of speaking in support of people’s bank last week in Canberra

I joined Chris for another episode of the independent, unfiltered Primodcast for a thrilling conversation on all the things mainstream media won’t cover.

Click here to listen on your preferred podcast platform.

Transcript

Chris Spicer:

What’s up, tribe? This episode of the podcast is brought to you by Bodyweight Built. Bodyweight Built has decided to jump on and support the show, which is obviously huge for me and the podcast but also a huge step in the right direction for independent media. Bodyweight Built is an all-in-one fitness app designed by fitness trainer and buddy of mine, Matty Fox. I spoke to Matt before Christmas, and I was telling him how I hit a plateau with my regular strength training. He recommended that I join the app, which I did. The results have been fantastic. I’ve shed body fat. My strength has gone through the roof, including functional strength, which is something that I’ve always struggled with.

Chris Spicer:

In the app, there are multiple eight and 12 week programmes all designed to be done without a gym and even equipment, which was great for me because I only had a few kettlebells and dumbbells. So, it’s been fantastic. On top of those programmes, there’s nutrition tips and tricks, yoga classes, plus much more. Listeners of the podcast, I want you to head to mattfoxapp.com to get started for just $1 for the first month. Just $1. There’s no lock in contract. You can cancel at any time. So, if you decide after a few weeks that it’s not for you, cancel, you’ve lost the dollar, no harm done. That’s mattfoxapp.com. I’ll also attach the link in the description of this podcast.

Speaker 2:

Ladies and gentlemen, ladies and gentlemen, podcasting, podcasting from Sydney, Australia, this is The Prime Modcast. Independent, unfiltered, and uncensored, beginning in three, three, two, two, one, one.

Speaker 3:

This meeting is being recorded.

Chris Spicer:

Nice. Got it. Senator Malcolm Roberts, thank you for joining me again. Third time.

Malcolm Roberts:

Third time. Third time lucky, eh?

Chris Spicer:

Yeah, you’re-

Malcolm Roberts:

No, you’re welcome. Always a pleasure, Chris. I enjoy talking with you.

Chris Spicer:

Mate, it’s great. It’s always good and very enlightening. And, mate, I get terrific feedback every time. So, you’re practically a co-host at this point, with three times.

Malcolm Roberts:

Yeah.

Chris Spicer:

What’s been happening, mate?

Malcolm Roberts:

Well, we’ve seen the people have made their decision in the election last week. A lot of people are very disappointed by it, but that’s the way democracy works. Suck it up and just live with it because they’ve made their decision. Some interesting facts, though, Chris, as you probably realise, I think this is the first time we’ve had a government that’s been elected with less than a third of the people voting for it. So, more than two thirds of the people did not vote for the Labor Party. I think this is the first time, certainly first time in a long time, that… I’m sure it must be the first time, but I can’t say that for sure because I haven’t checked, but it must be the first time ever that both the old tired old parties, Liberal Party, Labor Party, have got less than 32%, less than a third of the vote. So, oh, hang on, the Liberals might be just above a third.

Malcolm Roberts:

So, what we’ve seen, a very positive sign, is we’ve seen an enormous swing away from the Liberal, Labor, Nationals club. And that’s the duopoly. We’ve talked about that in the past. There’s no difference between the two parties. They both push the UN agenda. We saw a startling admission during the election campaign. Both Anthony Albanese and Scott Morrison, when asked about the UN’s World Health Organization’s International Health Orders/Regulations being changed to become coercive and take control over a country’s health system, intrude in it, they both said they were in favour of giving the World Health Organisation more power. Yet Morrison said at the start of this virus we needed to hold them accountable. And then he changed his mind very, very quickly, and he said, no, he wants to give the World Health Organisation more power. I think he said that in about April 2020.

Malcolm Roberts:

So I mean, these people are allowing the UN, if the UN comes up with this this year, this week, they will allow the UN to have more power over us. The other message that I think that came through from the election is that the Teals got a very focused campaign. They focused on just a handful of seats. They focus on Liberal seats. Fortunately, they were woke Liberals, so we haven’t lost anything by them going to the Teals. But they’re just a closet pro-Labor group. They’re funded, driven by a billionaire who is making a lot of money out of renewable energy, what I call unreliables. So, there’s something in it for him, by the look of it. So, they’re just masquerading as climate warriors.

Malcolm Roberts:

The Greens got an increase in vote as well. But both of those parties didn’t say anything concrete, didn’t say anything negative. They just silently went through playing TikTok videos and all the rest of it. I mean, complete crap. And I think what happened was people said, “We’ve had enough of two years negativity.” So, when we were pointing out messages… Our vote went up, by the way. We’re now the largest freedom party in the country by quite a way.

Chris Spicer:

Well done.

Malcolm Roberts:

Yeah. And it looks like we might get four, possibly five senators. So, it all depends, but that’s a very good result. Yeah. The other thing is that these people went through, the Greens and the Teals went through, basically just skated through without saying anything controversial, nothing specific. They locked down their senators. All the Greens’ senators were stopped from talking. Lidia Thorpe escaped for one session, I think, and embarrassed herself. So, they locked her up again. And… what’s her name? … Mehreen Faruqi did the same. But the Greens have shut up, and all they’ve done is relied upon what I would call immature videos and just emotions. And I think that reflects that people have had enough of negativity and they just want something clear. So, they’re not going to get anything, but that’s what basically won.

Chris Spicer:

Do you think it was more of a vote against Morrison than a vote for the other parties? Because it almost seems to me like it could be the fact that they didn’t want to vote for Morrison, but they didn’t really know who to vote for. Do you think that’s likely?

Malcolm Roberts:

I think you’ve nailed it. I said throughout the election campaign, Morrison’s best asset is Albanese, and Albanese’s best asset is Morrison. They’re both woeful. The Labor Party is pathetically weak and they’re deceitfully dishonest. What was I going to say there? Morrison failed completely because people started waking up to him being a liar. I don’t know if we discussed this topic last time, but he repeatedly said day in, day out for a couple of weeks there, “There are no vaccine mandates in Australia.” That is a complete lie. Everywhere I went, I would just turn the microphone over to the audience and say, “What do you think of that statement?” And they’d be yelling out, “Liar! Bastard!” this kind of stuff.

Malcolm Roberts:

But if you look at what Morrison did, while he was saying that, he bought 280 million doses of the injections. That’s 11 each. He then indemnified the states. He then said to the states, oh, sorry, the state premier said the decision that they made at the states to mandate the injections was in line with the federal, sorry, with the National Cabinet. Now, the National Cabinet is not constitutional. It’s just concocted. But who leads the National Cabinet? Who formed it? Who leads it? Who chairs it? It’s Scott Morrison. And then you see there’s something else that’s crucial. You cannot have these injection mandates enforced without the knowledge that whether or not someone is injected. And that data comes from the Australian Immunisation Register, which is a Federal Health Department. So, the Federal Health Department made it possible.

Malcolm Roberts:

So, Morrison bought the vaccines, bought the injections, spread the injections, led the cabinet that decided on the injections, and then enabled the injections to go ahead. Plus, his party, with a few exceptions, no exceptions from the Labor Party, but just a few Liberals excepted, they opposed the bill that I introduced, Pauline’s bill that I introduced into the Senate to outlaw discrimination based on injection status. And then the same parties, led by Scott Morrison, denied us even sending it to a committee. Labor, Liberal, Nationals, Greens all stopped us sending it to a committee so that you and the other people of Australia couldn’t have their say.

Malcolm Roberts:

And then you look further, Chris, and this bloody liar, he then… You see the Defence Department. Some people in Defence are mandated. Australian Electoral Commission is mandated, and they’re having trouble getting sufficient volunteers to run the election properly. Border Force is mandated, aged care is mandated. So, they’re actually going against the constitution mandating these things. So, you make up your mind. I’ve made up my mind. Morrison was a dead set liar. And people woke up to him. They woke up to him, and that’s why they punished him. Because the Liberal Party has plummeted down to, what, 50 something seats, isn’t it?

Chris Spicer:

Yeah. Well, they were annihilated, and I think it’s a lot of that. Well, the Liberal Party, to me, yeah, they’ve gone too far left with a lot of their policies and what they’ve done. And this has been, I think, accelerated since Morrison has been in power there, where the difference between Liberal and Labor, what is there? There’s nothing.

Malcolm Roberts:

Zero.

Chris Spicer:

There’s nothing. There’s no difference where-

Malcolm Roberts:

Name a policy.

Chris Spicer:

Well, that’s what I mean. The same. I mean, they used to be more leaning towards the right with their policies. That’s what the Liberal Party is known for, but now… My father’s been a Liberal voter his whole life, and I had a conversation with him the other day about it, and he said, “The Liberal Party’s not the Liberal Party. They’re not.” He goes, “They’re a shadow of Labor.” This woke nonsense that’s going on now and all the rest of it, it’s out of control. And now we’ve got a Labor government and the Greens who have a… I don’t know how many. You’d be able to know for sure how many people are in the Senate are from the Greens Party, but they’re going to get a lot of say.

Malcolm Roberts:

Well, the last Labor government was a Labor-Greens Coalition. There was a formal coalition drawn up under Julia Gillard, because she was the prime minister with that Greens-Labor Coalition. And we all know that the tail, the Greens, wagged the dog, the Labor Party. And so that’s what’s going to happen again. We don’t know the makeup of the Senate yet though, Chris, because the voting hasn’t been finished. The counting of the votes hasn’t been finished yet and probably won’t be for a few days yet. So, we won’t know the makeup, but it depends upon a couple of scenarios.

Malcolm Roberts:

If we get all the ones we look like we’re getting, then we might have some say in the balance of power, but if the Greens and the Independent in the Australian Capital Territory get it, then it’s going to be Labor-Greens Coalition in Senate. So, it’ll be Labor-Greens Coalition government. Oh, by the way, though, 15% of people, 15 to 20% of people, voted for Freedom Party. So, we now know that freedom is a definite… It’s smaller than I thought, but it’s still a sizable chunk of people. We now know that freedom is a very important issue, and I think that group is here to stay.

Chris Spicer:

Yeah, definitely here to stay. And I can tell you now that I can see it’s going to grow. It’s not going to shrink, it’s going to grow, because what I think is going to be coming in the next few years is really going to get a lot of Australians, maybe even the ones who really didn’t get too involved in it due to the mandates, but when we’re talking about these climate policies and all those different policies that are incoming is they’re going to really get the backup of a lot of Australians. So, I could only see the freedom movement growing, moving forward. But quickly back to the Senate, what’s the position? What’s going on with Pauline? Because I’ve seen a lot of talk online. And I’m smart enough to know not to buy into what the media is saying. So, I’ll ask you myself. What’s happened with Pauline? Because some of them are saying that she could potentially lose her seat. Others are saying that she won’t.

Malcolm Roberts:

Yeah. There’s potential for that. They haven’t seen the numbers today, because I can’t control them. It looks like she’ll be right to get back in, but it depends on preferences. Because what happened was Clive Palmer came in and split the vote for the freedom parties. And so did the Liberal Democrats. Now, if we get all of their preferences, or a lot of the preferences, of their voters, then she’ll be home easy. But what’s happening in pre-poll, sorry, what’s happening in the counting now is that they’re counting the postal votes, which were huge.

Malcolm Roberts:

And the Liberal Party is doing really well out of the postal votes. We’re doing well out of the postal votes. The Greens are falling in the postal votes. They’re not getting many. So is the Labor party. And so is Medical Cannabis. So, the threat originally was that the Medical Cannabis Party might overtake Pauline. That’s not going to happen. But the threat may be now that the third Liberal candidate might overtake Pauline, in which case she’d be knocked out. Or we might see Pauline go ahead of the second Labor candidate, which is a possibility. So, there’s a very good chance she’ll be back, but it’s not certain yet. So, we’re concerned about that.

Chris Spicer:

Yeah, definitely. I hope, obviously, everything works out for Pauline. She’s a light, and both you and Pauline have been a light for a lot of Australians for the past two years. So, let’s hope that things work out well. And so you’re safe, you’re fine, yes?

Malcolm Roberts:

Yeah. I wasn’t up for election, Chris, because the Senate has staggered terms, and I don’t come up till 2025. But the other thing there, I agree with your dad that the Liberal Party’s no longer the Liberal Party, but I disagree with him that it’s become… Well, it is a clone of the Labor Party, but I think we’ve got to take it a step further. They’re both taking their orders from the United Nations. They’re both implementing United Nations instructions. There’s no doubt about that. One of the reasons, a big reason that Scott Morrison’s Liberal-National Coalition won the 2019 election, when everyone said Shorten was going to romp it in, was because of their position supporting coal and especially their position saying that they would not support the UN’s 2050 net zero decision policy from the United Nations.

Malcolm Roberts:

Then two years ago, they adopted it. Within 12 months after the election, they adopted it. I mean, that’s just the last UN policy to come in place. And Liberals have adopted it when they said their mandate was to not have it. So, that’s what’s happening. And then you look at the World Health Organization’s International Health Regulations, you look at them, they’re coming in. Perhaps we can talk about it later, but a critical part of that is going to be that if we don’t adopt them, assuming they get passed this week in Geneva, if we don’t adopt them, then the world can apply sanctions to us. Now, you might say, “Well, sanctions are no big deal.” Well, they’re no big deal 40 years ago. But what’s happening is that people have realised this COVID thing was not set up in 12 months. It wasn’t set up in a few months. This was set up over the last 10 years. It’s been premeditated.

Malcolm Roberts:

But when you realise what’s happening, Chris, 50, 60, 70 years ago, we were independent, our country. We made everything we needed, almost everything we needed. We made our own toolmaking equipment for lathes, metalworking, making tools for manufacturing. We made it all. And we made some of it so well that we exported lathes and other precision equipment overseas. We had our own oil reserves. We’re now the largest exporters of natural gas in the world. We’re the second largest exporters of coal. We’re the largest exporters of energy. And yet if someone put a blockade on our country, within a matter of days we’d stop, grind to a halt, because our oil supply is stuck in the United States. That’s where our oil securities are, in the United States. I mean, this is crazy.

Chris Spicer:

It is crazy.

Malcolm Roberts:

So, you shouldn’t even let them get down low. But then, so in other words, the United Nations could just say, “We’ll put a blockade on Australia unless they take our World Health Org Regulations.” And so we would be really hurting ourself. Because what they’ve done, Chris, this has been deliberate over the last seven decades, they have deliberately made countries interdependent. Now, that sounds like a lovely thing. I’m interdependent on you. We can get on really well. We’re dependent on each other. Sounds good.

Malcolm Roberts:

But if you strip it all away, you’re dependent on me and I’m dependent on you. If something happens to me, you’re buggered. If something happens to you, I’m gone. So, what they’ve done is they’ve made us interdependent, which has made us dependent. And so now we can’t stand up for ourselves. That’s what the UN has done. And it’s been cold and calculated, and that was their aim to do that. This is not about COVID coming up in the last 12 months. It’s not about COVID coming up in the last 10 years. We know it’s taken that long to engineer this. This has been going on for seven decades, 78 years.

Chris Spicer:

Let me ask you a question about that, because a lot of people wonder, and sometimes I think about it as well. What is it with the United Nations and the World Economic Forum and all these foreign unelected agencies, what is it about them where Western leaders, they just comply with their demands? What is it? Is it the threat of sanctions and that sort of thing that give them no choice but to go along with it? What is it that is pushing them to adopt policies? So, let’s just say Albanese, for whatever reason, decided that he doesn’t think signing onto the World Health Organization’s treaty is a good idea and he doesn’t want to do it. We know that’s not going to happen. We know that he will sign onto it. So, what is it? What is it that drives these Western leaders to just go along with it?

Malcolm Roberts:

Well, there are a few things. First of all, the World Economic Forum had… Well, no, first of all, the United Nations and the World Economic Forum were both formed to push the agenda of the globalist predators, the major, major corporations, BlackRock, Vanguard, and the people who own them, the Rothschilds, the Rockefellers, et cetera. So, they control most of the large corporations across all kinds of industries in the world. They wanted to get more control. Because what’s happened, if you go back to the way we used to live in Europe and in Britain was feudalism.

Malcolm Roberts:

So, the baron or the lord of a region controlled all the land, owned all the land, and you and I would work as serfs. We would basically slog our guts out, die at an early age after working all our lives. And we would be given a plot of dirt that we could grow our crops on. And that would have to carry us through. The majority of our work, our product, would be given to the lord of the manor, but we would keep enough just to keep us alive. That was feudalism. We were controlled by the lord of the manor, and we worked for him.

Malcolm Roberts:

Then we had the Industrial Revolution, and we had freedom breakout, and we had the middle class. And the middle class was not controlled. It was free. And so the globalists don’t want that. What the globalists want is control. And so the whole thing about this UN and World Economic Forum is control. So, what they want to do is they want to control property. I won’t go into it now, but there are many things that they control. Our property. If you control property, then you control the people. They want to control our energy. They’ve got control of our energy. They want to control our water. They’ve got control of our water. They’ve got control of many of the policies in both parties.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now, how have they done that? It goes back to things like the… what is it? … Young Global Leaders programme. Justin Trudeau from Canada, prime minister, he’s a graduate. Macron from France, he’s a graduate. Merkel, I’m told, is a graduate. Biden is affiliated with the World Economic Forum. They’ve actually said, the head of the World Economic Forum has said that what they’ve done is they’ve infiltrated governments around the world, especially in the West, and they have got control of those governments. Ardern in New Zealand is a graduate of the World Economic Forum’s Global Young Leaders programme. Sarah Hanson-Young, the Senator from South Australia with the Greens, is a graduate.

Malcolm Roberts:

Andrew Brag. It’s not just the Labor Party and the Greens, it’s also Senator Andrew Bragg from the Liberal Party. He’s a graduate of the World Economic Forum Young Leaders programme. Greg Hunt was the… what was he? … Director of Strategy for the World Economic Forum in the years 2000 and 2001. Greg Hunt pushed through things that drove the basis for an international carbon dioxide trading scheme, which will give the UN money, give them a guaranteed revenue source once it’s implemented. Greg Hunt pushed the climate scam. I presented data to him that shows it’s not caused by us at all, there’s just natural climate variability. Greg Hunt told me to my face, he said, “That’s the best presentation I’ve ever had on climate.” The CSIRO, as we were discussing off air before, one day we can probably talk about that, they’ve never presented any evidence. No one has presented this evidence. And so Greg Hunt has pushed this through based on bullshit. The others have fallen behind the same way.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now, the globalists also push the media and they control the media. And the media narrative has been to just, “Climate change is real and it’s caused by us,” when both are wrong. The education system has been taken over by the control side of politics, what most people call a left-wing, and that’s indoctrinated people. So, most people around the age of 30 now, they think that it’s real because they’ve been indoctrinated all the way through. They can’t tell when they’re at a young age that it’s indoctrination or education. They’re not thinking for themselves at a young age in primary school. It starts in primary school. It continues on TV, on the media. It continues in university. If you want to speak out against the myth of manmade global warming and global climate change, you won’t get a job at a university.

Chris Spicer:

Yeah. No.

Malcolm Roberts:

You’d get fired. So, what happens is these people have been coerced by the media. They want votes. So, Frydenberg looks like he’s out of parliament. Frydenberg is a climate sceptic. He doesn’t believe it, and yet he’s pushing it because what he thinks is that as there are more Green voters moved to his inner city Melbourne electorate, then he has to try and appeal to them. If he came out and actually told them the truth, we’d knock this whole thing on the head. But instead what happens is the woke politicians, the gutless politicians like Frydenberg, Seselja, who’s not a bad bloke, actually, but he became woke because he’s in the Australian Capital Territory, Sharma, Zimmerman… who’s the other one? … Wilson, these people have got no evidence. I’ve had an argument with Zimmerman about it, and I trashed his argument about climate change. These have got no evidence, but what they’re doing is they’re kowtowing to inner city Greens voters.

Malcolm Roberts:

And Chris, if you kowtow to that without any evidence, then you’re endorsing it. They’re actually strengthening the Greens’ position, and they’re strengthening the Teals’ position. Zimmerman, Wilson, and Sharma were replaced by Teals. Frydenberg will be replaced by a Green. Oh, hang on, no, that’s a Teal as well. So, what they’ve done is they’ve created their own demise because of their gutlessness and their stupidity and their ignorance. So, that’s the way. It’s not a simple story. But, oh, the other thing that they’ve done to push this climate change rubbish and the control by the UN, when you watch, when you dismantle the control methods they use for pushing the climate scam, it applies to so many things.

Malcolm Roberts:

You showed me a little while ago that billionaires have advanced because of the COVID virus. Billionaires have advanced because of the climate change myth. And what they do is they make sure that the billionaires get their palms greased and make a lot more money out of it so that the billionaire says, “Sign me up.” Then when they become prominent signatories of the climate change, or the COVID, or whatever, they’re on the gravy train. But their voices are influential, and they con a lot of people into thinking that COVID is a serious problem that has to be dealt with with controls, climate is a serious problem that has to be dealt with with controls. So what you see is deceit, money, and you see massive control. That’s the objective, control. And there are many ways in which they’ve done it, but that’s some of the ways.

Chris Spicer:

Well, that’s right. And that’s what a lot of people often say, “Okay, but why do they want control? Why do these people like Bill Gates and George Soros and these characters, why do they want control?” And I say, “Well, listen, people like you and I, just born into a normal household, average income, our parents weren’t wealthy…” I’m assuming your parents weren’t wealthy.

Malcolm Roberts:

No.

Chris Spicer:

But certainly not billionaires. Certainly not billionaires, right?

Malcolm Roberts:

No, they weren’t wealthy.

Chris Spicer:

So, we’ve had to work for everything. And you’re driven not necessarily by money, well, by money, but to use for good or to give your family a better life. That’s my dream, and that was your dream. But these people that are born into families with endless amounts of money, like Bill Gates… Bill Gates’ father was loaded. Bill Gates never had to work for anything in his life. He never had to. He never missed out on anything in his life. He had it handed to him. Those are the people that grow up and chase. They don’t need to chase money like you and I. They’ve already got it. They chase power, they chase control.

Malcolm Roberts:

Bingo. Bingo.

Chris Spicer:

And they’re relentless in that. It might be originally, “Oh, I wonder if we can get people to wear face masks.” Then they’ve got that amount of control. “I wonder if we can get them to lock up inside their homes for a number of months.” They’ve got that control. They’re after power and more control. They’re not going to get to a point and think, “Okay, we’ve got enough control now.” It’s never going to end. So, people need to understand that the way they think, the way their brains operate, isn’t like the average person. It’s different.

Chris Spicer:

So, you can’t really understand it. Because we’re all stuck in the rat race, the 9:00 to 5:00, and trying to earn money and give ourselves and our families a better life. They don’t need that. They need control, and they want more power. And that’s, I think, where a lot of that comes from. So, it’s almost asking the average person, “Why does a serial killer like Ivan Milat, why does he do that? How could you do that? It’s evil.” We don’t understand it because our brain chemistry isn’t the same. And it’s the same with these people like Bill Gates. We can’t think. It’s irrational to us because they’ve got a different makeup than we have.

Malcolm Roberts:

Let me give you an example. This is from a Canadian broadcasting system, which is a bit like the ABC, this Canadian Broadcasting Corporation, a government owned station. They made a video, a… what do you call it? … documentary, mini documentary, about an hour long, on Maurice Strong. Now, you say, “Who the hell’s Maurice Strong?” You may know of him, but he was the guy who fabricated global warming, fabricated climate change. He was the guy who said that he had two aims in life. Get how sick this is. One is to de-industrialise Western civilization, de-industrialise us, take us back to the caves. The second is to put in place an unelected socialist global governance.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now, I can run a company so long as I get into a position of influence, I can run a company’s board of directors without having the dominant vote. I can do that because of personality. You can do it because of personality. We know that boards of directors are generally filled with people who just kowtow. They’ve been selected to do that. So, someone can take over a company effectively without having a vote. That happens. You can take over countries the same way. It happens. You can take over a football club. It happens. So, Maurice Strong, this is his background.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now, he became very senior in the United Nations. He basically ran the joint. So, when he was 17, he did an intern at the UN. And just think about this. The guy came back from that place as an intern. And someone asked him, “What was your impression, young Maurice?” And he said, “That place will have enormous power one day.” What 17 year old thinks like that? “That place will have enormous power one day.” Now, think about this. It backs up exactly what you said. Then at the age of 25, he was running a large… Well, no, not a large but a significant oil corporation, producing oil. Got that? Producing oil.

Chris Spicer:

Yeah.

Malcolm Roberts:

And he says, “I’m doing pretty well, but I want something else.” So, he puts his company in the hands of another manager and goes off and works for Canada’s most influential family. Canada’s most influential family at the time, I can’t remember their names, controlled both sides of politics. There’s that word, control. So, he works for them. And then someone asked him, “Is your ultimate objective to get into politics?” “No, no, no, no. That’s not where the power is.” The power. So, he ended up commissioning a report on the state of the world, or state of the Earth, or state of the planet, whatever it was back in 1970.

Malcolm Roberts:

So, 1970, he commissions this report, and it comes back and says the world’s buggered. We’re going to hell in a hand basket. Okay. So, he then uses that report to develop the United Nations Environmental Programme, a department within the United Nations called UNEP, United Nations Environmental Programme. And guess who becomes its first head? Maurice Strong. So, the people who sit at senior levels of the United Nations are basically diplomats, failed politicians, and bureaucrats. And all of a sudden, you get Maurice Strong coming up in there, and he’s sitting as head of UNEP. He’s sitting one level below the United Nations Secretary General, the head of the United Nations. But he’s in that top management group.

Malcolm Roberts:

And so he starts developing lots of policies about the environment. And we know there were some problems with the environment in the 1970s, because people had just started getting right into industry, new technologies, and they were making mistakes. But the significant thing was that people were correcting those mistakes. They don’t like lakes being set on fire, covered in oil, beaches covered in oil. So, anyway, Maurice Strong then makes the environment the issue. So, all of a sudden, people are saying, “We need environmental policies.” By the way, the Nazis did the same. So, this has been copied from the Nazis in Germany.

Malcolm Roberts:

So, hang on, the head of the UN and the other bureaucrats that live just below the head of the UN, they know nothing about the environment. So, they all say, “Well, what do we do, Maurice?” And Maurice tells them what he’ll do. Then Maurice concocts the global warming scam, 1970s, he created that. In 1988, he formed the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change. He was an exceptional brain, an exceptional networker, very good at manipulating people. He then started controlling people like Greenpeace, WWF, or having significant influence on them. Then in 1992, he led the United Nations Rio Declaration, which was about 21st century global governance. And he got control of the floor, of the delegates. He brought a lot of people in from overseas, through Greenpeace and WWF, and they all spoke very strongly in favour of climate action.

Malcolm Roberts:

So, see how he started it? He then had a conference in 1980 in Villach, Austria, where they invited the chief climate scientists from around the world. They came, and they had a conference. And they were presented with a document that said, “Sign this. It’s a declaration stating that we need to cut our carbon dioxide.” And the scientists said, “No, mate, we’re not signing that because there’s no evidence for it.” So, 1985, in the same town of Villach, Austria, they had another conference, but this time Maurice Strong organised it so that they picked the scientists that would represent each country. And guess what? They passed a motion saying that our carbon dioxide affects global warming, even though it didn’t. And so then he got the 1992 Rio Declaration, which was about 21st century global governance. I’ve got the document. Hang on, I’ll just get it. There’s been many, many documents written about this. The United Nations are not denying it. Can you see that?

Chris Spicer:

Yep. Summit Agenda 21. Yep.

Malcolm Roberts:

Yeah. Agenda 21 came out in 1992. When it first came out, that was Agenda 21: 21st Century Global Governance. They’re warning, by the year 2000 for the 21st century global governance in place, they would control everything. And at first, our politicians… They all signed up to it, by the way. Keating signed up to it on behalf of the Labor Party, and our prime minister in 1992. At first, the politicians on both sides denied it. Pauline spoke out about it in 1996. Then when people became more informed about Agenda 21, they went, “Yeah. Well, it exists, but it’s got no teeth.” What they didn’t tell people was that they were pushing through parliament, sometimes in regulations avoiding the parliament, regulations that would control various aspects: our energy, our water, our property rights, our regulations on how we live, what kind of food we eat. They were being drafted. They control all of those things, and they’re seeking more and more control.

Malcolm Roberts:

And why do they do it? Because they like power. Maurice Strong, at 17, said, “That place is going to have power one day.” That attracted him. He then influenced all this power. This is how one man can shape the world. And people say, “Well, hang on a minute. That’s a bit unusual.” I said, “No, it’s not, because you’ve had Genghis Khan. Well, Genghis Khan, Alexander the Great, we’ve had Hitler, many people trying to control the world. Maniacs.” And if you look at these people, there is some maniacal bent in them. I mean-

Chris Spicer:

All of them.

Malcolm Roberts:

… look at Gates. Look at Gates. But the significant thing, Chris, is that always beneath control, there is fear. So, if you try to control me, it shows me that you’re afraid of me. Otherwise, you wouldn’t need to control me.

Chris Spicer:

That’s right.

Malcolm Roberts:

So, these globalist freaks, these globalist predators that are trying to control, are doing so because they’re afraid. And what are they afraid of? Well, if you go to the ultimate, the ultimate… what’s the word? … deceit is the way they create money. And we’ve had this proof from the Reserve Bank of Australia’s Deputy Governor, Guy Debelle. I asked a question in Senate Estimates. He confirmed it. They create money out of thin air. Now, the significant thing there is that people don’t really think about money. It’s in everything we do. It’s intimately woven into every single thing we do in our lives. So, we take it for granted. But if you sit back and say, “How do they come up with a dollar bill? How do they come up with a $2 coin?” It’s just journal entries and “electronic journal entries,” to use Guy Debelle’s words. They just pull it out of thin air and just write it down. So, they can create all the money they want.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now, that’s a wonderful system if you’re the one controlling the money printing, but it’s not for us. Because what happens is that these people control governments, and they have done for centuries, literally control governments because they control the central banks. Now, in the case of the United States Federal Reserve Bank, it has power over so many other countries because the dollar is essentially the global currency, until Putin came along. But anyway, it’s the global currency. So, the Federal Reserve Bank is privately owned. Privately owned. As Ron Paul, Senator Ron Paul said, Federal Reserve, it’s neither federal, state, federal government, it doesn’t have any reserves. It controls the money supply. It controls the interest rates. It controls everything in the United States.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now, our reserve bank is not owned by anyone other than the people of Australia, but it’s controlled by major bankers, which is the Bank for International Settlements, which is a central bank of central banks. So, what we’ve seen is a massive control of funds. And the same people who have the control behind the scenes over you and I also control BlackRock and Vanguard, which own most of the corporations. And what I believe they want us to do is to go back to being serfs in the futile times where we eke out a living. And that’s what’s behind the Digital Identity Bill. We get just enough to survive so that we’re producers, and they can scram all the profits off us. And they can also control the money. But what they’re afraid of is people waking up and taking over.

Chris Spicer:

Yeah, which is happening. I mean, there’s a lot more people now than this time last year that are actually speaking about these things, which is great because that’s what we need. Individually, you and I, what can we do? Nothing. It’s going to be a collective effort and just enough to make them uncomfortable, just enough to make them think about it twice or even prolong it. Just say they wanted to achieve this by a certain date. If there’s enough pushback from the people and they can see that, hold on, the people are getting a bit restless, they’ll prolong it, prolong it, prolong it, prolong it. And what we’ve seen in the past few years is an incredible acceleration from these globalists trying to achieve their goals and what they… Yeah. The Great Reset, which I’m sure you’re very familiar with. So-

Malcolm Roberts:

Build back better, The Great Reset, New World Order, you name it. And the significant thing, Chris, is that those slogans are used by Ardern in New Zealand, Trudeau in Canada, Macron in France, Merkel in Germany, she used to be there, Morrison, Boris Johnson. They’re used within hours of each other. It’s all coordinated.

Chris Spicer:

Yeah, that’s right. And that’s what I keep saying to people, “We’ve just got to keep speaking. Just keep doing your part.” We all have our part. Obviously, your part, you can speak to the parliament. You can speak to a wide range of people about these issues. I’m lucky that I’ve got a big platform to raise these issues and speak on. But even to the average person who may not have that, a big following or whatever, just speaking to family about it, speaking to their mates at the pub about it, just getting the word out so people, or at least it’s in the back of their mind. So, when they raise things, for example, the Labor Party with the co-ownership of the housing, 40% equity in the homes, the minute I heard that, I thought, “Oh, we’ll own nothing, but we’ll be happy.” Straight away I heard that. I thought, “That’s exactly what they want.” I mean, I believe that’s a step in that direction, because it’s blatantly obvious.

Chris Spicer:

Then yesterday I see an article down in Victoria, it was. I’ll bring it up. I’ll read it to you. There we go. “Proposed petrol car cutoff date in Victoria in Environment and Planning Committee report.” This is from the Herald Sun. “A Greens backed parliamentary inquiry has recommended a cutoff date for the sale of new petrol cars.” So, things are moving at an incredible rate. They really are. And I just hope that the cash ban, that I think it was yourself and Pauline that stopped that happening a few years ago, it’s actions like that. Because imagine if you didn’t stop it back then. Imagine where we would be now. We wouldn’t have had cash for a few years. We’d be in all sorts of trouble.

Malcolm Roberts:

Well, you’ve got to have cash because it’s an alternative to the digital currency they have said they’re bringing in. At Davos in the World Economic Forum this week they’ve talked about the digital currency. The Australian Banking Association’s Conference a few months ago that I went to, every single speaker talked about either the digital identity or the digital currency. The reserve bankers talked about it. They’ve been working on it for years. Davos has admitted that they’re working on a digital currency. The Reserve Bank of Australia has admitted they’re working on a digital currency globally and interacting with other nations. So, with that cash ban, it’s very, very important, because if we don’t have cash, there’s no alternative. You will go on that digital currency.

Malcolm Roberts:

And then they will determine what the value of that currency is from day to day. And if you don’t behave yourself, you’ll have less value in your digital currency. If I behave myself and kiss their arse, I’ll have more value. So, what they’re doing is they’re trying to get coercion in. But what you said a little while ago about the cash ban was significant. It was my office. I was the one who raised the awareness of this. We went to the Labor Party, and the Labor Party said, “Yeah, you’re right,” but they voted for it through the lower house. The Liberals pushed it through the lower house. So, then when it came to the Senate, we created such a stink with the crossbench and we put so much pressure on Labor that it was consigned to a committee to be evaluated.

Malcolm Roberts:

We also then got in touch with significant players in the grassroots membership of the Liberal Party. There’s a couple of them stood up in Victoria, and good on them. Steven Holland in particular was one of them. Not the swimmer, but another Steven Holland. And we had talks with them, and we had talks with other people in the grassroots. And they created such a fuss in the Liberal Party that the Liberal Party let it go. And so we moved a motion in the Senate saying that we would dismiss that from the Senate list. And it’s gone.

Malcolm Roberts:

But they’re coming back because the Digital Identity Bill is where they want to bring back another cash ban. So, we’ve got to fight that. But we will beat them, Chris, providing we do exactly what you said, talk to our friends, talk to our family, talk to our workmates, talk to our sporting mates, and spread the word. And then speak up with the politicians, put pressure on the politicians, as they did in Victoria with the cash ban. Speak up and spread it out. The other thing that gives me a lot of hope is that… How can you put it? We had questions of the Digital Transformation Agency in federal Senate Estimates, right?

Chris Spicer:

Yep.

Malcolm Roberts:

Mate, they struck us with their incompetence, that they can’t do this. They will try, but they can’t do it. But they’d cause a lot of damage by trying to do it. So, what we can do is make sure that they don’t do it by spreading the word, then destroy anything that they can create. Just not cooperate, just hold them accountable everywhere they go. But they’re not going to be able to do this. And the other thing is that control, always beneath control there is fear. These people, except for the very senior level, are either afraid and they’re pushing this… Even the senior level is afraid. But imagine being one of these people pushing these controls. You couldn’t do it, Chris.

Chris Spicer:

No.

Malcolm Roberts:

Even if you wanted to, even if they were rewarding you, you couldn’t put your heart and soul into it. They’re not going to beat our passion and our energy across the everyday Australians. They are not knowing what they’re doing. They cannot put their whole heart and soul into it. So, this is not a fait accompli. They’ve got enormous power, but they haven’t got the will. They haven’t got the real passion.

Chris Spicer:

No. And look, there’s so much going on at the moment too, that I feel like a lot of people, their brains are just overloaded with so much. I mean, you’ve got COVID, which is still going on, not to the degree that it was 12 months ago, but still very-

Malcolm Roberts:

Well, the fear of COVID. COVID is not really the problem. It’s the government restrictions and the government fear and sensationalism, that’s the problem.

Chris Spicer:

That’s the problem, but that’s not where it is. A year ago to today, you can’t compare the two. People don’t care anymore about COVID. But instead, we’re hit with this monkeypox. Then, on top of that, there’s a war in Ukraine that dominated the airwaves for weeks. Now, all of a sudden, no one’s talking about it. So, that’s what they do. They almost intentionally overload you with so much information, and there’s so much going on at any given time that… We just got over COVID, two years of it, of government interference and overreach, and then, bang, monkeypox. The first thing I think of is, “Fuck. Here we go again. Here we go.” And this time it’s going to be worse because it’s not going to get any better. So I thought, “Well, it’s going to be worse.” But that’s sort of sitting idle at the moment.

Chris Spicer:

But it’s just, look, I don’t understand how… I speak to my mates about this all the time. I say, “I don’t know how the average person doesn’t think, ‘Hold on. What’s going on?'” Because me personally, I’m 29 now, prior to COVID, there was nothing. There was an occasional bad flu season every five, six years. That was it. Then in the space of three years, we’ve been hit with bushfires, COVID, floods, more COVID, floods, monkeypox, the war in Ukraine. That’s in three years. That hasn’t happened in the 30 years that I’ve been alive. So, that should ring alarm bells in itself as to why are all of these events… Just where are they coming from? Why is this happening? Why are we having an outbreak of monkeypox that’s in 12, 13, no, it’s now 15 different countries, when, if you know anything about the virus, it’s uncharacteristic of the virus to pop up like this? Why is this happening? Why is all the-

Malcolm Roberts:

It’s shingles.

Chris Spicer:

Well, I’ve got Dr. McCullough coming on Monday to have a chat to me about it and get his opinion, because everyone’s going to have different opinions on it. It looks like shingles when you look at it. It could be they’re masking vaccine side… Who knows what it could be? Who knows? But what I do know-

Malcolm Roberts:

Well, they did say-

Chris Spicer:

… they’re pushing bullshit.

Malcolm Roberts:

Yeah, they’re definitely pushing bullshit. What people have been saying for about six months now… Oh, what’s the name of that virus supposedly coming out, starting with the letter M? Mergon or something like that. And anyway, they said that there will be a virus coming out that will hide the vaccine injuries. And this could be it, the people keeling over, because we know that they’re doing that in the thousands. Hospital admissions, ambulance trips have been skyrocketing. And they’re in case they’re… what do they call it? … category one hospital trips, which is heart problems. “I wonder what that could be,” says Yvette D’Ath, the State Minister for Health. I wonder, Yvette. It’s no wonder at all, but-

Chris Spicer:

Yeah, I know.

Malcolm Roberts:

… you look at these things-

Chris Spicer:

I heard that. I remember when she said that. I’m thinking, “What do you mean, you wonder?” You’re not a stupid woman. Come on. Just, we know what it is.”

Malcolm Roberts:

She’s either deceitful or dumb. But climate change, invisible. COVID, invisible. Bushfires, there was not a problem there. Those bushfires were nothing unusual by our standards in this country. They were less than earlier bushfires in our country, including in the 1800s, including the 1974, including earlier on in the 19th.

Chris Spicer:

Let me just quickly, sorry just to disturb you, just quickly, well, just let me finish this part about monkeypox. So, I wrote an article the other day about it, because I’ve heard about monkeypox for quite a number of months and I was anticipating it somewhere to pop up unusual. And I wrote an article on it. And do you know, they ran, there’s actually two sets, there was… I’ll try and find it now. I did publish it on the… I’ll tell you what. Because I don’t know if you know, and if you don’t know, you wouldn’t believe it. It’s almost hard to believe. So, they ran, like they did with COVID, prior to COVID they ran Event 201, which is a simulation of a coronavirus outbreak.

Malcolm Roberts:

Yep, yep, yep.

Chris Spicer:

I’m sure you familiar with that.

Malcolm Roberts:

Yep. They had several simulations.

Chris Spicer:

Yeah, that’s right. In March 2001, there we go, the NTI, which is the Nuclear Threat Initiative, they held a tabletop exercise focusing on reducing high consequence biological threats with catastrophic consequences, and the virus they used for that simulation was a genetically modified version of monkeypox. Now, in September last year, the UK Ministry of Defence, they used… There’s a software that’s called Conductor. I don’t know if you’ve heard of it. It’s this software that you can run simulations, where it brings up fake Twitter profiles and fake Facebook and all the rest of it. You won’t believe this when I tell you. And it’s all there. That’s the little graphics for the event that they ran. So, you can find it. It’s on Google. It’s online, right? So what it was, well, here, on Conductor, so this was the UK Ministry of Defence, they ran a simulation about how the world would react to Russian disinformation during a monkeypox outbreak. I’m not joking. They ran that in September last year before the war on Ukraine was going on. Why are they running that event in September? Come on! That’s not a coincidence. It can’t be.

Malcolm Roberts:

No. Well, they’ve had six years of Russian disinformation. No, sorry, disinformation about Russia. We had Trump being accused of being allies with the Russians, complete bullshit. And then there’s another thing. So, the fires, coming back to the fires, there’s nothing unusual there except that the media blew them up. Nothing unusual at all. And the media blew them up. And then you see Ukraine, that was the other one, Ukraine, all we’re getting is one side in the media. That’s all we’re getting. I stood up in parliament and said, “Hang on, hang on, hang on,” I was the only one to do so, “Hang on just a minute here. All we’re getting is the Foreign Minister saying this, we’re getting the Labor Party saying the same thing, getting the Liberal Party saying the same thing, getting the Greens saying the same thing.”

Malcolm Roberts:

The Greens, by the way, are the greatest control freaks in the country. They want to inject people. They’re very much into control, because they’re pushing the UN agenda for them, and the UN’s all about control. And so we had all these people saying, “Just follow Ukraine. Bash Russia. Bash Russia.” And I said, “Hang on a minute. I’m not going to take a side here because I don’t know enough. But I’m going to ask one question. What the hell are we doing? Where is the information? Let’s stop and not just follow America into another war.” Because we followed America into so many wars in the last 100 years.

Malcolm Roberts:

And there again, Chris, you look at Ron Paul. Senator Ron Paul mentioned that in a book I read, a very good book, it’s End the Fed, end the Federal Reserve Bank, he said, “Every…” And this guy is phenomenally educated, self-educated largely, but very, very strong and respected by both sides of the house in America, both sides of politics, incredibly well-respected, very strong, very honest, very competent. He said, “Every major war since 1913 when the Federal Reserve Bank was created is directly attributable to the United States Federal Reserve Bank.” Every major recession is directly attributable to their policies. They flood the joint with cash. Does this sound familiar? They flood the joint with cash, lower interest rates. People overcommit. Then they jerk up the interest rate suddenly and people collapse and foreclose.

Chris Spicer:

That’s what’s going on now, right here.

Malcolm Roberts:

Okay? That’s the basic mechanism that they’ve done time after time after time. And that’s how they engineer it. Because who takes over the assets when you foreclose? The banks. Who owns the banks? The same globalist predators, BlackRock, Vanguard, the same families that run the whole lot. So, all of these things attributed come back to the use of money and the control of the people who control the money.

Chris Spicer:

Yeah. It’s just, look, I don’t know what’s going to happen here. I mean, interest rates, there’s talk they’re about to go up to 2%, then they’re projecting up to 4% by this time next year. With the way the fuel prices are going, fuel is well and truly back over $2 a litre again. Now, I can speak about it because I know. Obviously, I’ve got a young family with five kids. And it’s tough, very, very tough, to the point where-

Malcolm Roberts:

Especially when you’ve been mandated out.

Chris Spicer:

Well, that’s right. That’s exactly right. So, it’s just the pressure. You’ve got an event or you get invited to a family gathering or whatever it may be, it’s a few hours away up the coast or whatever. It’s going to cost you a couple of hundred dollars in fuel just to get there. You got to take that. You never used to have to worry about that. But when fuel’s up around $2.30 a litre, you got to think about it because that’s a huge chunk of money that’s coming out of your budget. It’s almost forcing you to stay local because families can’t afford to be going on holidays because the fuel’s so excessive. I mean, it’s double what it was a year ago, a year or two ago.

Chris Spicer:

I remember about three or four years ago it got down to 86 cents a litre in parts of Sydney, and now it’s $2.30 a litre of fuel. And there’s no end in sight. We’ve got food shortages. The food comes back and they’ve hiked the price up on that. And then they’re imposing sanctions on Ukraine and they’re blaming that for a few of the cost of living issues that we’re dealing with here. And it’s like, “Well, stop sanctioning them. Stop it. If you’re making the Australian people suffer because you’re sanctioning Russia because they’ve made innocent Ukrainians suffer, you’re doing the same thing with your sanctions,” if that’s what they want to blame it on. I mean, if they’re saying that a lot of this, the inflation at the moment and shortages of different produce, is because of the war in Ukraine, because of their own sanctions, stop it.

Malcolm Roberts:

Well, mate, one of my researchers is extremely good, and he’s been across all the topics we’re talking about for quite a while. He’s been alerting me to the fact that so many food processing plants are shut. Shut.

Chris Spicer:

Yes.

Malcolm Roberts:

In America, they’ve got the largest… And TNT Radio, for anybody who’s listening, when Chris is not on air, go and listen to tntradio.live. I can tell you more about that.

Chris Spicer:

That’s right. You’re on Saturdays.

Malcolm Roberts:

Yeah, I’m on every second Saturday. But during the week, phenomenal, they tell the truth. They talk about the topics we’re not allowed to be talking about. I heard Rick Munn on the evening show. He’s broadcasting out of Belfast, Ireland. He said that the largest baby formula factory in America was shut down a few weeks ago because of some bacterial infection. They found out that it wasn’t due to that factory. It was false. But the thing has not opened up since. It’s still shut down. So, they’re trying to drive the price of baby formula up by making it scarce, or they’re trying to just make it scarce and put pressure on families. There is so many food processing plants in the United States, something like 30, shut. That’s creating an artificial food shortage. So these people, I don’t know how they’re doing it other than through ownership of the major companies like maybe Nestle, maybe some of the other food companies. They’re all owned by the globalist predators as well, BlackRock and Vanguard. So [inaudible 00:57:37]-

Chris Spicer:

Because it’s not even a conspiracy, it’s a fact that they’re impacting, they’re deliberately impacting, well, causing food shortages in America. The baby formula shortage in America is horrific. I know babies are going to hospital now and some are probably dying due to not been able to get… There was one lady who said that she’d driven, I think, 300 kilometres from her home, well, 300 miles, whatever that is in kilometres, from her home to find formula and put it. So, is it control? Is it just to put the population just in shambles? What is it? What are they gaining from that?

Malcolm Roberts:

Both of that. What they gain is control over people, and they get then cheap Labor. They get us basically back to feudalism, back to communism, working as slaves. These people have destroyed property rights, which is fundamental to a free democratic society. They haven’t destroyed them, sorry, but they’ve destroyed them in certain sectors in this country. And I mentioned it to a group of doctors who invited me to their meeting. These are doctors against the mandates, oh, a couple of months ago. And they suddenly had woken up. They realised it wasn’t just them being impacted individually. It was a whole medical fraternity being impacted. And they suddenly realised they’d lost their profession. The whole profession has gone. And I said, “Now you know how the farmers feel like.”

Malcolm Roberts:

Because farmers in Australia lost their right to be able to use their property. They’ve got to get permission from people to grow certain things. I mean, this is just insane. If you own property, you bought it to produce whatever you want to produce on it. So, losing property rights is fundamental to a return to communism. Destroying religion, and they’ve destroyed that not with guns, but they’ve destroyed that. They’re destroying it by infiltrating the churches. The churches have come up with woke policies now that push climate change. The churches have been shut down during the COVID restrictions, the government’s COVID restrictions. The churches were shut down, but the pubs weren’t. The abortion places weren’t, but the churches were. So, they’ve got an all out war against religion, because people turn to religion for guidance and a code of conduct. When the church is gone, they’re buggered.

Malcolm Roberts:

So, they’re also destroying the family through the family law system, which was introduced into this country in 1975 by a Labor government. It doesn’t matter, Labor or Liberal, it’s the same. And they are destroying families. They’ve injected the kids, infiltrated the kids’ education, indoctrinated the kids with all kind of gender bending influences, all kinds of sexuality changes. And then they’re just indoctrinating them with climate change crap. So, they’re changing the family, the construction of the family.

Chris Spicer:

The family unit, yeah.

Malcolm Roberts:

They’re changing nation states. They’re destroying the borders between nations. Fortunately, Abbott stood up. Tony Abbott stood up. He’s the one leader we’ve had who stood out by actually doing what was right on so many issues. I think he’s aware of some of these things. But he was under so much pressure from his own party, people like Malcolm Turnbull, that he couldn’t do the whole job properly. So, they’re destroying the fabric of our society, destroying the foundations of our society. They’re destroying our borders.

Malcolm Roberts:

And what they want is a global governance, which means you don’t have national borders, you don’t have elections, unelected global governance, and they just control things. They make the decisions that will determine your life, what you’ll eat. And they’ve seen it. Davos has talked about this. They will soon be able to track your so-called carbon dioxide output or usage. And that will then enable them to say, “Well, Chris, you’ve had too much carbon dioxide produced this week because you’ve eaten too much beef. So, therefore, you’re going to be cut back next week.”

Chris Spicer:

That’s happening.

Malcolm Roberts:

They want to control how we live. I mean, they said it. It’s not me saying this. Davos has said it.

Chris Spicer:

Well, in Sydney, I don’t know if you heard about this, a few weeks ago, Channel 9, it was, obtained a report from, I think, the New South Wales government about distance-based tolling. Did you hear about that?

Malcolm Roberts:

No. Oh, distance-based tolling. So, in other words, you pay per kilometre however far you drive?

Chris Spicer:

Yeah. So, just say I want to go into Sydney Harbour, and, well, where I do live is probably about 70ks out of Sydney, I will pay a lot more to go there than what somebody would who lives 20 or 30ks away. So, they’re going to charge you-

Malcolm Roberts:

Well, that’s fair enough. That’s fair enough because somebody uses less energy should be paying less. But it depends on the structure, how they’re going to do it, because I’m guessing it’s to control so that you don’t drive very far, you’ll catch a bus.

Chris Spicer:

Well, that’s what it is. It’s-

Malcolm Roberts:

They want us inducted in the scheme. Of course.

Chris Spicer:

Yeah, that’s right. And you’re seeing that now. I mean, Victoria, they’re well-advanced in terms of this. They’ve already got electric buses. They invested a huge amount of money to get electric buses, and even buses now where you can put your pushbike. They’ve created these. Did you see that? The Victorian government have created buses where they’ve got bike racks on every single bus so you can load your pushbike up to the front of the bus and then take the bus. So, that’s what they want. They want us out of cars. They want us into buses, electric buses, which is what it will be, riding pushbikes. Out of cars, that’s what they want. But back to your religion for a second that came after-

Malcolm Roberts:

I’m going to have to go, Chris, because I’ve got an appointment at 1:30, so it’s 17 minutes past.

Chris Spicer:

No, you’re right. It’s gone fast, hasn’t it?

Malcolm Roberts:

Yeah, it has. We’ve covered a lot of territories.

Chris Spicer:

It always goes fast. But I’ll finish on this point, as to why they’re coming after religion, I believe. I think it’s a lot harder to control a man who has faith. A lot harder. Because he doesn’t fear you. He won’t fear you. He fears God. He won’t fear the individual. And on top of that, a lot of our moral compass comes from religion. So, destroying that is another way of demoralising us. That’s my reasoning for it, because a lot of people ask me, “Who cares? It’s only religion.” But those are the points that I make, that a lot of our life here is from religion.

Malcolm Roberts:

You’re correct. You’re correct, all those things. That’s what Lenin said, that’s why he wanted to destroy religion. It’s one of the first things you do. You are absolutely correct. History has shown that repeatedly, mate. You’re spot on.

Chris Spicer:

All right. Well, I’ll let you get to your meeting. Malcolm, it’s been a pleasure, as always.

Malcolm Roberts:

Same here, mate. Keep going. We’ve got to have independent media, what I call independent new people media.

Chris Spicer:

Yeah. Well, it’s going well. There’s a big market now. From when I first started till now, it’s great. I love seeing it. Because to me, it’s not competition, for me, I love it. It’s, we’re a community. I don’t look at another show as a competitor. It’s a community. And good work with what you’ve been doing, and also Pauline. Thank her for me as well that you both have been incredibly important to this country over the past few years.

Malcolm Roberts:

It’s her birthday today, mate.

Chris Spicer:

Pauline’s birthday?

Malcolm Roberts:

Yeah.

Chris Spicer:

Happy birthday, Pauline. Yeah. Make sure you pass that on for me. But-

Malcolm Roberts:

Will do.

Chris Spicer:

… yeah, again, Malcolm, thank you very much.

Malcolm Roberts:

You’re welcome. And thank you for what you’re doing, Chris. Really appreciate it.

Chris Spicer:

Thank you, mate.

Australia claims a very large part of Antarctica as our territory. Despite this, China is muscling in, refusing to sign treaties and building 5 research bases in the Australian Antarctic territory. To add to the worries, Australian Government has back-flipped on its plans to build a strategically important, all-weather runway at Davis research base.

This opens the door for China to do it instead, further eroding our claim to Antarctic territory.

The decision came from the minister for environment which begs the question, have we let China take a strategic win because we were a little bit worried about the penguin’s feelings?

Transcript

I think the last stretch.

Thank you, Chair. Thank you for being here tonight. Minister Sussan Ley recently made a decision to not proceed with the building of an all-weather runway at Davis research base in Antarctica. What level of consultation did the Minister have with the Department of Defence and what advice was received prior to making such a decision, which many see as retrograde?

Senator, I can probably assist with that. That was a decision taken by the Government. There was extensive consultation with a range of departments and indeed I and Mr. Ellis personally, were in discussions with the Secretary and the CDF and others on that matter before it was considered by Government.

I understand Defence were pushing it.

I think the view taken by the Government was that the combination of the very significant environmental impact, the proceeding with the airstrip, would do together with the very sizable cost, ultimately meant that proceeding with a project that would not provide results for another 15 or 20 years was not viable. However, there are a whole range of other ways that we are very confident we’ll be able to ensure continuing and indeed expanded presence in Antarctica.

Was the Minister aware of the likelihood of China then building the strategically important runway, thereby enhancing its claim for a portion of the Australian Antarctic territory when the Australian Antarctic territory is renegotiated, or even sooner, because China is not a party to the Treaty?

A full range of geopolitical and other considerations were available to government in taking the decision, Senator.

Is the Minister aware that China has already built five research bases within the Australian Antarctic territory to enhance its future claim?

The answer is yes, we certainly are aware. I’ll let Mr. Ellis answer as to the number, but certainly we’re aware that China, and indeed a number of other countries, have established bases in the area claimed by Australia.

Does this mean that environmental issues, such as the comfort of penguins can be used to negotiate, to negate issues of national security to the detriment of all Australians? You mentioned that, you mentioned the 15 year time span for the return, I’ve just come from the Australian Rail Trade Corporation and they’re talking about a 30 year timeframe.

Some of these projects do involve a long period of time, Senator. But the answer is that we are very confident that the right decision was made, taking into account all of the factors and, as I’ve said, indicating that Australia’s is continuing presence. Our scientific research, our expeditionary exploration are second to none and we’ll continue over the decades ahead.

So is this yet another example of the short-term strategy visions that have dogged Australian antarctic policy, antarctic policy making us a pushover for the Chinese Communist Party?

I wouldn’t agree with the premise of any of that Senator, Australia very significantly ensures that we are a strong player in the international system that focuses on Antarctica, on CCAMLR and Australia, through investments, such as the Nuyina, which we’ve just been talking about at 1.8 billion dollar investment together with all of the other activities that Mr. Ellis and our hundreds of staff, both in Hobart and in Antarctica undertake, we believe that we are very much ensuring Australia’s interests are protected and advanced.

Perhaps a question to Senator Hume. The Chinese Communist Party just rolls over weak leaders. They see in Australia a country that is handed over its sovereignty to many UN agreements, destroying our energy, for example, our property rights, UN policies gutting our culture. These get no respect from the CCP and I think it makes us targets. So, was this the best decision to make at a time of heightened concern about the expansion as policies and aggression of the CCP? Especially as what they’re doing to us in trade.

I don’t necessarily agree with the premise of your question, Senator Roberts, but what I will say is that Australia in no way will be ceding any of our territory. The decision that was made was always gonna be contingent on a final investment decision next year and careful consideration of the environmental impact, economic investment and broader national interests. Australia feels that it’s particularly important that all nations place the Antarctic environment at the absolute centre of their decision making, and respect to the Treaty system. And the government is now considering further investments in our scientific research and environmental programmes in Antarctica. That include to continue to create jobs and investment for Tasmania, as the international gateway to East Antarctica.

Thank you, Chair.

[Attendant] Thank you very much.

Sensitive Defence information is still being held at data centers owned by Global Switch, a Chinese-owned multinational company, despite promises to have all government data migrated out by 2020. Regardless of the complexity of the move or data being “less sensitive”, this is an unacceptable situation. The Chinese Communist Party must be laughing at our Government.

Transcript

Okay, thank you. Getting onto storage of defence data, including critical secure data. In February, 2021, the Australian federal government renewed its contract with the firm Global Switch, despite serious security concerns. The company has hosted Australia’s sensitive and high security data for some time. Elegant Jubilee, a Chinese consortium, bought 49% of the parent British company Alders Gate Investments, causing an ownership change for Global Switch in 2016. Then treasurer Scott Morrison said in 2017 that the defence data would be shifted back to a government owned hub for security reasons. After he became prime minister, he later decided to extend their contracts with Global Switch. Does the firm Global Switch still host Australia’s sensitive and high security defence data?

Senator, Jeff Goedecke, First Assistant Secretary ICT Service Delivery and Reform. The Global Switch facility, which is completely controlled by the commonwealth, does hold some of the less sensitive data. There are as indicated in the release by secretary Moriarty in February last year, there are plans in place to migrate that data from Global Switch by 2025. This is in accordance with the whole of government hosting strategy.

So why was it decided to continue this arrangement, hosted ultimately with, with Chinese ownership?

It’s, it’s, it’s not Chinese ownership. As I said, the Commonwealth owns, has complete control of the facility, both from a physical perspective and from a, and a, a protection from a logical sense, from an ICT perspective and security perspective. The amount of equipment and data, and the complexity and interdependencies, necessitate a longer term to remove these things. There’s a, a great deal of reliance on defence business continuity, that requires a staged approach to remove this stuff. It basically, the complexity and size of the footprint, the payload inside the data centre, means it was impossible to, to move that over a very short period of time.

So when was the decision last made to, to leave it there, and eventually you take it off by 2025?

So, just bear with me, Senator

And Senator, Greg Moriarty, Secretary of the Department. All of, all of the highly sensitive information is, is long gone. So what, so-

What sort of information is there?

Well, this-

So we, so what happened was the government approved, back 2018 for defence to be funded to move what was sensitive data from the data centre out. That occurred by June, 2020. So that was all removed. Because of the size of the footprint of the remaining data, which is less sensitive data, again, still protected from a government perspective and government controlled. There was a, there is a process in place now where we are, have an evolution to move that data out. And that ties in with the additional lease, which expires in 2025.

So what is that less sensitive data?

It, it’s for a range, range of things. It could be administrative related. It could be some sort of logistic, but we wouldn’t normally discuss exactly what type of data we hold in what locations.

So there’s no risk whatsoever of the Chinese accessing it, ’cause they’re pretty good hackers.

There, there is no risk.

What, what, why can you be sure of that?

It’s, it’s based on the, the the facility itself has physical controls in place. That’s everything from, from it being a fully manned facility, it has all of the CCTV capabilities. It has, you know, alarms, it’s fully accredited. And in fact, the facility is accredited to look after more sensitive data. That hasn’t changed. So there’s a higher level of security than would normally be afforded that level of data, which is an important factor as well. In addition to that, we have ICT securities. So cybersecurity controls where we, we monitor that we have a, the defence security operations centre monitors cyber activity. And that includes that within the footprint as well. Gateway, secure gateways also assure the information. So from a defence perspective there aren’t risks related to that, Senator.

Has it been tested at all? ‘Cause the Chinese, some Chinese are very good hackers. I’m sure you know that.

Absolutely. So there are, defence has no indications at all that there’s been any compromise at all related to data held in that facility.

So it’s not a case then of the, the Fox looking after the hen house?

Not at all.

Okay.

No, but, and, and just to make sure that, I mean, that, that is why the government has, has directed defence to move all of the data by a particular point in time. Senator, we believe that the mitigation strategy that we have in place is very robust for the, for that level in, in fact, as Mr. Goedecke said, it’s, it’s much more significant wraparound than what normal data of that level would be. But we are moving out. We are, we are gonna remove absolutely any risk by, by removing ourselves from that, from that data centre. And the government has, has agreed the timeline.

Thank you. And thank you, too.

Additional Information

https://www.itnews.com.au/news/defence-delays-global-switch-data-centre-exit-by-up-to-five-years-560042

https://www.afr.com/companies/telecommunications/federal-bodies-struggle-to-exit-chinese-owned-data-centre-20200304-p546p5

Transcript

Hrvoje Moric:

Geopolitics & Empire is joined by Queensland, Australia, Senator Malcolm Roberts, who is part of Pauline Hanson’s One Nation political party. I’ll be getting his thoughts on the tyranny that is coming at us from all angles in Australia and in the world. Good morning, Senator, and thank you for joining the podcast.

Malcolm Roberts:

Good morning, Hrvoje. It’s a pleasure to be here, and thank you very much for the invitation.

Hrvoje Moric:

I mean this as a great compliment, Senator. I’m a big fan of former Texas Congressman Ron Paul, whose views I think largely aligned with yours. I hope you don’t mind me calling you the Australian Ron Paul.

Malcolm Roberts:

I don’t think I’ve earned enough to deserve that, but I’m delighted that you call me that. Ron Paul is one of the best people in the world. He’s got courage, he’s got integrity, he’s got character, and he stays in touch with the people. He calls out the Federal Reserve Bank in America. He wants to have an audit of them. He fights for peace rather than defence. Wonderful man, wonderful, self-educated in economics, very, very bright man. I’m not even close to him, but thank you. I sincerely feel deeply honoured.

Hrvoje Moric:

I think it’s just easier for some of us who live outside of Australia to get an idea a bit more of Australian politics and the work that you do. There’s a lot going on, Senator, but I suppose we can begin with the public health emergency situation or pandemic in Australia and the world, but especially in Australia where the government is implementing many unbelievable restrictions on freedom. These include vaccine passports, the restriction of the right of movement, locking people in their homes, censorship, elimination of free speech, in some cases, perhaps rendition to quarantine facilities, the destruction of businesses, and so forth. Some of these issues you’ve commented on. How do you view the seemingly never-ending public health emergency that’s been going on now for two years and now these unprecedented permanent public health emergency measures being put into place? What’s going on?

Malcolm Roberts:

Well, how I view them? I view them very simply as immoral and inhuman, that they’re unlawful, unjustified. That’s how I view them. First of all, you mentioned a number of points and I’ll try to capture some of them. You talked about a pandemic. I never use the word pandemic because there is no pandemic of deaths, Hrvoje. None at all. If we look in Australia, then we have normal death rates as compared in past previous years. So then people in Australia might say, “Well, hang on, we’ve had lockdowns, that’s why we’ve not got a pandemic of deaths.” Okay, well, let’s look at other countries in the world. Nowhere is there a pandemic of deaths.

Malcolm Roberts:

For a pandemic, you must have a steep increase in deaths. That’s not happened anywhere. Now you could argue then Sweden, where there was no lockdowns, no quarantining, no real falling in line with the international globalist agenda, they did have an increase in deaths. Yes, they did, because some of the people who are falling victim to COVID have comorbidities. Obesity is one of them, for example, but they have comorbidities. Those deaths were probably brought forward. But now we see Sweden reverting to the mean. So even Sweden, there’s no pandemic of death. As I said, pandemics have to have a pandemic of death; there’s nothing here.

Malcolm Roberts:

The only thing with regard to the death data that’s unusual in Australia is since the injections have been introduced. Now we’re seeing that the number of deaths is above the upper range, and we believe that that is… Well, it’s not explained. So it raises serious questions about the injections, because we know that the number of deaths and that the adverse effects is far, far higher than people are telling us. We know that. We know that anecdotally. We also know that the Therapeutic Goods Administration in this country has supposedly investigated the 564 reported injection deaths that doctors have reported, but they have toned them down to just nine. So we have now asked the question of the Therapeutic Goods Administration in this country, “Show us the process by which you assess that.” That’s the first point I make: no pandemic of deaths.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now, the second point I make is that I’m not dismissing COVID at all. COVID does kill people, there’s no doubt about it. But I’ve asked for the data from our Chief Medical Officer for the federal government, and he has shown me that the data on transmissibility says that the transmissibility is high. You can catch it easily. But the transmissibility on… Sorry, the severity data shows that it’s low to moderate, much less than past severe flus. And so, what we are seeing is not something that’s severe, it can kill people, but we’re seeing that it has not been managed properly in this country. I’ll come back to that in a minute.

Malcolm Roberts:

The third point that I wish to discuss is you raised vaccine passports. I do not agree with the term vaccine passport. I do not agree with the concept. I go totally against the concept of the vaccine passport. But my opposition is more fundamental than that. These are not vaccine passports, they’re vaccine prisons. They’re injection prisons. They’re digital prisons. They keep a group of society away from society. I’ve not been injected, that’s my choice. But I pay my taxes, therefore, I’m entitled to the benefits of being in this society. I’m entitled to being treated as a human who is part of this society and wants the interaction. So digital prisons, vaccine prisons are not human. They’re immoral and inhuman. That’s the third point, I think.

Malcolm Roberts:

And the other point you mentioned was about quarantine. We don’t have quarantine in this country. We have lockdowns. Lockdowns are where you isolate everyone. You withdraw everyone from society, and that’s what we’ve had. It’s cruel, it’s barbaric, it’s inhuman. Quarantines are where you isolate the sick and the vulnerable. Now, I go back to the start of this in this country, Hrvoje. We had parliament basically shut down. And on the Monday, the 23rd of March 2020, we had our first single day session of parliament, where we met to sweep through the government’s bills. Now, what I said to them on that day was, “Look, we’re looking at the tens of thousands of deaths reportedly in overseas countries, like China, Italy, Spain, France, et cetera. So we know there may be something severe, so we have to treat this as serious. So, that’s the first thing. Secondly, we’re not going to stand in your way, we pass the legislation. Third thing, we expect you to get the data, you must get the data. And with that data, you must build a plan. And then we will hold your accountable.”

Malcolm Roberts:

We still have no data given to the public. The data I got from the Chief Medical Officer contradicts what the government is doing. There is no credible plan other than one plan for… It’s not even a plan, it doesn’t have responsibilities, it’s just inject, inject, inject. Everything in this federal government is based on one strategy, injection using something that has not been proven, not been approved. Even the government says it’s provisionally approved. So it’s not been fully tested. And on that basis, we’re destroying our country’s economy with withholding human basic human rights, withholding freedom. This is fundamental to our society.

Malcolm Roberts:

The next thing that I want to mention is that we have destroyed the notion of democracy in this country. We haven’t destroyed it, the government has destroyed it. At state level, we have Liberal, Labour, and National party governments, and at federal level, we have Liberal, National government with a Labour opposition. All of them have ignored the data. All of them have proceeded with just one strategy. In the states, it’s lockdowns. In the federal government, its injections. Now, on the 23rd of March 2020, on that fateful Monday, I pointed to two things. I pointed to the in vitro trials which were promising at Monash University in Melbourne on a drug called ivermectin. I also pointed to Taiwan and South Korea. Taiwan has been by far the best performing when it comes to managing COVID, by far the best, without a doubt. No one hears about them because the UN suppresses news of Taiwan. But Taiwan uses a proper system of testing, tracing, and quarantining. They lock briefly, partially, partially, after about 12 months after the virus arrived, because they had a breach in quarantine that they wanted to get control of quickly. They have demonstrated how lockdown should be used.

Malcolm Roberts:

Even the UN’s crooked, corrupt, incompetent, dishonest World Health Organisation now says that lockdowns are a weapon of last resort and should only be used initially to get control. Our state governments, Hrvoje, are continuing to use lockdowns, which means that after 19 months, they have not got control of this pandemic… This virus rather. It’s not a pandemic, this virus. So what we’re seeing is a complete breakdown in management, it’s mismanagement. We are seeing the people being lied to, we’re seeing the exaggerations in the media. We’re seeing censorship in the media. And censorship is a form of control. And wherever you see control, beneath control, there is fear. This government, our state governments are afraid of the people with the truth.

Malcolm Roberts:

We have also seen now injections of an unproven, not-fully-tested drug that’s been injected into healthy people and is killing healthy people. That’s the first time this has happened in our society, healthy people being injected with something forcibly, coerced into injections, and dying from it. The second thing is we have seen governments deliberately and consciously suppress the use of ivermectin, make it illegal. But ivermectin is a proven, safe, effective, affordable, and readily available treatment that is working in other countries overseas. We are being denied here. That is genocide in this country. So yes, I’m totally opposed to what the government is doing with mismanagement of this virus.

Hrvoje Moric:

Yeah. I would go back to what you said at the beginning about the mortality rate. I read this week from official mainstream sources in Germany that for the year 2020, there was no excess mortality. I did an interview 10 months ago with a Canadian scientist from Quebec who actually investigated the mortality rate, and again, there was no excess mortality. So by definition, we are not in a pandemic, but as we know, the World Health Organisation, they’re fudging, they’re changing all of the definitions of pandemic, they’re changing the definitions of vaccine, and so forth. I just wanted to dig a bit deeper on what you’ve mentioned about the economy and these vaccine passports as they’re called.

Hrvoje Moric:

The biggest fear that most of us have is what they’re calling now this great reset, this total digital transformation of our society’s economies. I’m getting emails every week from all over the world, from Canadians, from Australians, from Americans and British folks, looking to escape from their countries where it seems what you were describing in Australia, that this is happening right now in these countries. And some of us, I’m here in Mexico, we’re afraid that this is going to come to us. And so, could you perhaps tell us a bit more about how bad do you think this is going to get? And this vaccine passport, which is basically a digital ID, which is basically a social credit system, if this gets implemented and it continues, we won’t be able to live, to do anything without the express permission of the government and corporations. I saw a clip of you five months ago, you were interrogating the Australian Department of Health on this, and they were saying they were not working on this, but now we’re seeing these systems being deployed. So how bad do you think this can get?

Malcolm Roberts:

There’s a wonderful poster behind your left shoulder, “Liberty begins with you.” We need to remember that the people who will allow this most ultimately are the people themselves. In a democracy, the governed are governed only with their authority. So the government is given the authority by the governed to govern. That can be withdrawn at any time at an election. So liberty does indeed begin with you. Democracy begins with you, the individual voter. That is something we have forgotten about in this country. It’s not something I’ve forgotten about, but generally across the country, it has been forgotten and ignored.

Malcolm Roberts:

The problem here is governance, national governance, state governance. The overarching problem is the lack of parliamentary accountability, not holding the governments accountable. The parliaments, nowadays in this country, serve the political parties, the tired, old political parties, the major parties. They do not serve the people. The reason for that is because the people have lost sight of the fact that they control the government. They elect the government, they should hold the government accountable.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now, I blame the people for that, but at the same time, I also give the people some excuse for that. Because what’s happened is the political systems have been manipulated by both the tired, old parties, the Liberal, Nationals, and the Labour Party, so there’s only two parties opposing. The other parties have been suppressed. Both those parties alternating in government effectively have the same policies. They pretend they’re different, but they’re not. And so, the bureaucracy runs to the same tune over decades. And what we’re seeing now is a deliberate attempt to control the people. That’s the first thing. But the people ultimately are responsible, and they can rise up against this.

Malcolm Roberts:

Let’s go back to proper management. Our country has about 25 million people. Taiwan has 24 million. So we’re about the same size. Taiwan is a tiny island. It’s half the size of our smallest state in terms of area, which is Tasmania. It is 2% the size of the state I live in, Queensland, which is our second biggest state. So it’s a tiny fraction of the area of Australia. Taiwan also had a bigger risk with the virus coming in because they have exchange with China, mainland China, which is very close, but they have enormous numbers of people going in and out between the two countries.

Malcolm Roberts:

So the virus originated in China, in Wuhan, we know that. So Taiwan was much more susceptible to the virus at an earlier point. They also have a highly densely populated country, which means virus is much more easily transmitted across the country. But Taiwan, the leadership there is trusted, and I’ll come back to something else in a minute, the… What did they call it? I was introduced to it the other day. What are they? The catfish principle. I’ll come back to that in a minute. Taiwan has a much higher risk with the virus.

Malcolm Roberts:

In the first 12 months of the virus in Taiwan, they had seven deaths, seven. That’s it, not 700, seven. They never locked down their economy in the first 12 months at all. They just continued their economy as they went. They used proper testing, tracing, and quarantining. And when I say testing, not necessarily COVID testing. People were tested on their body temperature. And if they were above normal, they were set aside and given a COVID test. And if they were negative on the COVID test, they went to work as normal. So that’s how they managed it, vigorous tracing system. And if people were sick or if they were vulnerable, they were quarantined and protected, but the economy kept going. Now, Taiwan’s economy came down about 0.6 of a percent their GDP. When you consider that their main customers are North America, China, and Europe, their main customers were decimated because they were locked down, but Taiwan’s economy well hardly missed a beat.

Malcolm Roberts:

In Australia, though, we had a much lower risk with the virus, but our lockdowns, at the end of our first 12 months, we had almost 1,000 deaths, and we crippled our economy. We put people in misery. We withdrew human rights. Taiwan didn’t do anything of the sort. That’s the really important figure to understand. Now, I was talking with someone from Taiwan, knowledgeable person with Taiwan. Actually, I’ve talked with a few people. But this one on Saturday told me, in Canberra I met with him, and he told me of the catfish principle. I looked it up on Wikipedia, and the Norwegians actually raised this story first. The Japanese love eels, and Taiwan grows and produces eels. So they used to ship the eels to Japan live, and then not many would survive. And then someone came up the idea of putting a catfish in the container with the eels. That keeps the eels on their toes because catfish eat eels. Many more catfish survived because they were alert, they were active. The same thing happened with fishing in Norway.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now, the point is this, when I looked in the first 12 months at the country’s doing best with managing the virus, properly managing it, Israel, Taiwan, South Korea, Hong Kong, Singapore. Now, some of them are no longer at the best level. Israel has succumbed to the injections, they’re having massive outbreaks. Singapore has succumbed to the injections, massive outbreaks. Hong Kong, we know has had more control exerted over it by China. South Korea had a major outbreak due to a lapse in their management, but they got it under control again. Taiwan had a major breakdown in quarantine, but they got it in control again. So Taiwan is the stellar performer. Taiwan did not lock down, they used proper testing, tracing, quarantining.

Malcolm Roberts:

All of those five countries that did well initially are countries with an element of threat. They value their security. Israel, we know why they value their security and why they’re under constant threat. South Korea, similarly. Hong Kong, similarly. Singapore, now it’s not under military threat, but it doesn’t have any natural resources, so it is under threat economically. And Taiwan, the same, both militarily and economically. All of these countries have governments that manage them properly because they know that if they make a mistake, millions of people are at risk. Our countries, Australia, America, Canada, Britain have got fat and sloppy. We are no longer well-managed, and that’s the core. The people in these countries that I mentioned, Taiwan, South Korea, Singapore, Israel, Hong Kong, are on alert for threats. We’re not. We’re fat and sloppy, and that’s the problem. We have got a complacent population that lets the government do whatever it wants, and we have to stop that. I hope that summarises the answer.

Hrvoje Moric:

Yeah. I wanted to shift gears a bit to a different topic that… Well, it seems like it’s a different topic, but it’s really not if we listen to what the establishment and the elites are talking about, and that’s the climate issue, which you’ve been outspoken on. I’ve examined the issue of what once was called global cooling, I think, back in the 1970s, and then became global warming, which then became climate change. I find the thesis without merits. I find it to be nothing more than a ruse by an elite wishing to establish a technocratic control system, which also espouses their long-held philosophy of eugenics. I was shocked last week, we recently had Boris Johnson on television. I don’t recall when the clip was from, but people can find the clip where he jokingly says, “We should feed human beings to animals.”

Hrvoje Moric:

And his father, Stanley Johnson, on television said that a biological weapons mega event would be great because it would eliminate huge chunks of the human population. And so, as I mentioned before, now they’re trying to merge these two issues of pandemic and climate change, and now they’re talking about climate lockdowns. You’ve mentioned this in one of your speeches, they want to get rid of our meat, and they want us to get our protein from insects, which is pretty insane. And so, what are your thoughts on this climate agenda and climate lockdowns and so forth?

Malcolm Roberts:

Again, complete fabrication. And I’ll go into that in more… We might have to extend this to do this. But I didn’t address a couple of your points in your last comment about the virus mismanagement. You talked about the great reset, and you talked about digital identity and digital controls. The government in this country, which is supposedly democracy, but as I’ve said is not a functioning democracy… By the way, the definition of a… well, maybe not definition, but the characteristic of a true democracy is where the government fears the people. If the government misbehaves, the people toss them out. In a totalitarian dictatorship, the people fear the government. In this country, the people fear the government. Not in the sense of a Eastern European country behind the Iron Curtain when it existed, but certainly, the people fear the government here because of the draconian laws that we’ve had brought down on us.

Malcolm Roberts:

The government, we’ve seen legislation that they’re going to introduce next year. It’s called, get this, the Trusted Digital Identity Legislation. Trusted Digital Identity. Why would they call it trusted? Because it is not worthy of trust. What they want to do is control people with it. Now, I haven’t read that bill, but I’ve had an excellent staffer researching that bill, and she has come back with the report that another staffer who assigned her a job has said is horrific. That’s what they’re wanting to do here, they’re wanting to control people. The great reset is about controlling our whole life, controlling our economy, controlling our energy use, controlling our resources and access to resources, controlling water, controlling farming, controlling the food we eat. That is the great reset.

Malcolm Roberts:

We know that there’s a minister in this country who used to be the environment minister, his name is Greg Hunt. He worked in 2000 and 2001 on secondment to the World Economic Forum. He was Strategic Director. He developed some of the strategies that they’re using. He then became a representative in Australia’s parliament. He then became a minister. He became an minister for the environment, which oversaw climate. And this was under the Liberal-National Party government. As a minister for the environment, he was responsible for suppressing a review into the operation of the Bureau of Meteorology, which we know is corrupting the data. They have actually admitted changes in the data, have increased the warming rate. They’ve admitted that to me. What they haven’t acknowledged and what we’re chasing them on, is that that has been systematic.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now you’d think, Hrvoje, that errors in data, we know exist, and with better management and scrutiny, we can adjust the data, but you’d expect all the data errors to be random. Instead, what we see is from 1970, say this is 1970 in the graph, the data has been systematically increased in a linear fashion to exaggerate warming. The data prior to 1970 was decreased, so we have a much greater slope. So, that was fabricated. We see this as a ruse. You’ve mentioned that in 1976, the big call was for catastrophic global freezing due to hydrocarbon fuels, coal, oil, and natural gas. Now we see global warming, but now… Actually, we saw global warming, now we see climate change due to hydrocarbon fuels. These people are just fabricating whatever they want to get control of hydrocarbon fuels. Because whoever controls our energy, controls what we do.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now, it goes back. So it’s a complete fabrication. There is no evidence anywhere in the world. I have held NASA’s Goddard Institute for Space Studies accountable. I’ve held our CSIRO accountable, Commonwealth Scientific Industry and Research Organisation, which provides the government with this data. Now, that minister that I told you about a minute ago, Greg Hunt, who was responsible for the environment and putting in some of these policies that protected these people who are adjusting the data and called upon the government to do something about climate based upon the CSIRO, that same man is now our health minister, putting in place a lot of these pandemic routines.

Malcolm Roberts:

We also see that I held for the last 12 years members of parliament, media, academics, government agencies accountable for their claims about climate. Not one of them has been able to provide me with the empirical scientific evidence proving that carbon dioxide from human activity affects climate. No one anywhere in the world, Hrvoje, has been able to quantify the specific effect of carbon dioxide from humans on climate, not even on temperature. So without that fundamental thing, quantifying the effect, you cannot make a policy. Without that, you cannot set targets. You cannot assess progress towards achieving those targets. You cannot do a cost benefit analysis. No one has got it anywhere.

Malcolm Roberts:

The leader of the government in the Senate, Mathias Cormann… formerly leader, sorry, he left and became head of the OECD, where he’s putting in place a lot of these globalist agenda. I asked him a number of times in the Senate for his empirical evidence proving the carbon dioxide from human activity effects climate, it needs to be cut. Never once did he provide it. He always resorted, ultimately, to saying, “We have to fulfil global responsibilities, our global duty. This is crap, Hrvoje. It is absolute crap. It’s run by a few companies, leaders, the globalists, the elites, to further their own nest to get control.

Malcolm Roberts:

I want to mention Maurice Strong. You’ve probably heard of him.

Hrvoje Moric:

Yeah.

Malcolm Roberts:

A criminal. Left the United States, a Canadian, left the United States where he was wanted for investigation into criminal activities by the American police and resided in China, in exile, voluntary exile. China is the main beneficiary of these policies. And Maurice Strong hid there. Maurice Strong, he died in 2015, was an exceptionally talented man, very, very gifted at networking, at manipulating people. He’s just one of these people who could do it. Now, he created the whole of this global warming scam, but it became climate change scam, back in the 1970s. He manipulated and formed the United Nation’s Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, the so-called scientists, that as a political organisation has never produced the science that proves that we need to cut carbon dioxide. And he has manipulated this throughout, and he’s done it by exerting control on the grassroots movements, people like Greenpeace, people like World Wildlife Fund, people like the other conservation organisations in this country that are pushing this crap. They’re just lies.

Malcolm Roberts:

We also have Prince Philip sometimes saying that he would like to come back as a virus and wipe out humans. I mean, what kind of person is this? I have a lot of respect for the Queen, but look at Prince Charles saying much the same kind of thing. Absolute insanity. And then we have the ultimate betrayal. When they can’t produce the evidence, they trot out an awkward 16-year-old who’s not very comfortable socially and put her on the stage and say, “We’ll do whatever Greta Thunberg says.” They parade her as the evidence. That is the complete logical betrayal of science. They’re putting up an awkward, unsociable 16-year-old, who’s now an 18-year-old, and portraying her as the reason we should do this. This is absolute crap. It’s blatant lies, blatant manipulation. I’ll say it again, they’re wanting control of our energy, control of our industry, control of our resources, control of our property, I didn’t mention that last time, but they’re controlling our property rights. They’re wanting control of water. These are fundamental, basic things about human existence. You control these, and you control everything humans do.

Malcolm Roberts:

They’re using what they call United Nation Sustainability, which is by definition reliant upon subsidies, which makes it unsustainable. Remove the subsidies and the account’s not sustainable. But with sustainability, they want to regulate everything we do, how we live, what we do. The second pillar of this United Nation’s control effort is biodiversity. “We’ve got to protect that fungus over there, those critters over there, the plants over there. We’ve got a toss you off your property because you’re less important than the fungus, the bugs, and the critters and the plants.” That’s rubbish.

Malcolm Roberts:

Then the third thing they want to do is to impose a globalist socialist governance, unelected. And that’s what Maurice Strong himself said many times, that that’s his two aims; to de-industrialise Western civilization, and to put in place an unelected, socialist, global governance. You don’t have to rely upon just Maurice Strong’s words because many senior people in the United Nations, the bureaucrats, Christina Figueres, for example, in charge of the United Nation’s Framework Convention on Climate Change, which oversees the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change, she herself has said is to bring in a new world economic order. The Lima Declaration in 1975 was passed by a Labour prime minister in this country, the following year was ratified by the Liberal-National’s prime minister. And that is both sides have passed that.

Malcolm Roberts:

That is about transferring wealth, transferring knowledge, transferring manufacturing from our country to places like China. This has been orchestrated, it’s been deliberate. They’ve admitted that with their statements, their own policies. And our dopey government in this country, dishonestly, is incorporating those policies into smashing our country, and the people are falling for it. So more and more people are waking up though, around the world. So to answer your question, will it happen? It depends on the people, liberty begins with you.

Hrvoje Moric:

You mentioned Prince Charles, and I believe it was just this weekend he brazenly gave quite a startling speech where he called for a global military-style operation that would cost trillions of dollars to carry out basically what you described. So they’re openly telling us to our faces, and that’s frightening. You mentioned China as well, which was the last theme I wanted to touch on. We recently had this new security pack between Australia, UK, and the US form AUKUS, or however you want to pronounce it. This is a sign that tensions are escalating between the West and Beijing. And Australia, you guys are stuck between the US and China. I’ve read analysis of the formation of this pact is one step towards war and even nuclear war. They’re talking about nuclear submarines. And then, Australia would become a jumping-off point for an offensive on China. As well as it would become a prime target for China. So what can you tell us about the current East-West tensions as well as Australia’s role in this new cold war with China?

Malcolm Roberts:

Well, you opened up with a comment about Ron Paul. Ron Paul, he’s self-taught. He’s a doctor, but he’s self-taught on economics and very, very capable on economics and finance matters. He’s gone right into the financial system in the United States and globally. He wrote a book called End the FED, and I thoroughly recommend it, people. It’s a book I like. Like me, it’s short, it’s simple, and it’s easy to read, but it’s packed with information, and very well written. He said that since 1913 and the formation of the Federal Reserve Bank, the privately-owned Federal Reserve bank, it neither has reserves, nor is it federal. It’s not a government entity at all, it is privately owned, privately controlled. We know that many more Americans are waking up to that fact.

Malcolm Roberts:

But he said that since 1913 and the formation of the Federal Reserve Bank, every major war, every major recession is directly attributable to the Federal Reserve Bank and its policies. Australia blindly follows the United States into war. When we had 9/11… And I won’t discuss that in any detail because it’s not something that I’ve researched deeply. I do have two questions about 9/11 though. How did Building 7 collapse? It was raised to the ground, and yet it’s never been discussed. No one’s asked that question. And why hasn’t there been a formal investigation into 9/11? George Bush didn’t have a formal investigation. His successor from the opposition didn’t have any formal investigation. We don’t know what happened. So there are two serious questions haven’t been answered.

Malcolm Roberts:

I raise 9/11 because our prime minister, John Howard at the time, was in America when it happened. When he came back, this is not me telling you this, these are the words of Alexander Downer, who was the Minister of Foreign Affairs at the time, the Foreign Secretary, if you like, when he retired a few years later, Hrvoje, he said that John Howard came back from America, marched into cabinet, and said, “We’re off to Iraq.” Just like that. That bypasses the checks and balances that are in place before we commit our men and young men and women to foreign a military action.

Malcolm Roberts:

If you remember the previous Gulf War, we had weapons of mass destruction. We had Colin Powell come out, I believe he was lied to, he came out later and said, “We haven’t got the evidence.” We had the president of America come out and say, “We don’t have the evidence.” We had the prime minister of Australia who told us, John Howard, that we went into that war in the Gulf War because of weapons of mass destruction admit that there were no weapons of mass destruction. We had people all over the military complexes and the governments of many Western countries, including Britain, said, “No, there are no weapons of mass destruction.” But they all relied upon that to start with.

Malcolm Roberts:

The reason I’m saying this, Hrvoje, is I question whether there really is any grounds for war. I question whose narrative we believe. Carbon dioxide, you are exhaling it right now. Everyone watching this is exhaling it. We inhale it in a concentration in the air of 0.04%, around four-one hundreds of 1%. It’s a trace gas because it is scientifically classified a trace gas. We exhale it at 100 times that level, 4%. So by definition of these lunatic running the show, you are a pollutant. You’re a polluter. I’m a polluter. This is complete crap. Carbon dioxide is essential for all life on this planet, but they’re telling us that is now a pollutant. It is not toxic. It is invisible. It is colourless. It is odourless. It’s not radioactive. It doesn’t give off light. It doesn’t give off any noise. It doesn’t pollute us. It doesn’t destroy the soil. It enhances the soil. It’s essential for a life on this planet. But they’re telling us it’s a pollutant.

Malcolm Roberts:

Now they’re telling us that this virus is a pandemic when clearly it’s not. And they’re using things to put in place controls. It’s the same with many of the things we’re being told, they’re blatant lies. They’re meant to coerce us, suppress us, and keep us under control and not question. Well, with people like me and with people like you and with an increasing number around the world, we’re saying, “Hang on, this doesn’t make sense.” It stimulates questions. And what I say to people is we have to remember, who controls the vote? We vote. We control who becomes government. Use your vote wisely. If you’re not happy with the candidates, become one. Stand up, talk to your families, talk to your workmates, talk to your social friends, talk to your relatives, get them to open their eyes, because as you’ve got on the poster behind you, liberty begins with you.

Hrvoje Moric:

I would just add if people can see… Where is it?

Malcolm Roberts:

Your head’s not that big. Now other side, other side.

Hrvoje Moric:

My thought on 9/11 right here. But yeah-

Malcolm Roberts:

It’s been [inaudible 00:38:37] out by reflection, I can’t see it.

Hrvoje Moric:

Okay. So, as you just mentioned, I get this question all the time. I said previously, but are you optimistic? I wonder why are there not more Ron Pauls, more Senator Malcolm Roberts in the world. There’s so few, and it seems like there’s actually a majority of us that agree with you. And many of the other politicians are for, whatever reason, towing the official government line. And so, why are there so few of you and are you optimistic? Are we going to stop this thing?

Malcolm Roberts:

We will stop it. It’s a matter of time, the time scale we talk about. If we look at nature, if we look at the universe, it’s inherently free. That doesn’t mean that you or I, or anyone can predict what will happen in the future, but it’s inherently free, and it’s moving towards increasing freedom. If you look at human society and human history, we’re increasingly going towards freedom. We have backwards steps at times that take us back into control. But ultimately, what emerges is freedom, and usually increased freedom. We’re in a pathway to higher freedom. So despite the setbacks, ultimately, this will all pass. Because we know that from history.

Malcolm Roberts:

President Harry Truman said, “The only thing new in the world is the history you haven’t read.” It’s all happened before, these attempts to control us. Now, in the past Hrvoje, and this is the really tricky point, in the past, if I held a gun to your head, everyone could see that Malcolm Roberts was controlling Hrvoje. Nowadays, we don’t do it that way. The control freaks use intimidation, coercive to shut down free speech. They call you, for example, a climate denier or they say you don’t respect nature, or you don’t respect the environment. You go against caring for the environment. We know of so many scientists who have been suppressed into silence because of that intimidation.

Malcolm Roberts:

We also know they use other things like, for example, they’ll call you a racist and that’ll silence you. They’ll call you a misogynist or a misandrist. They’ll call you a Nazi. They’ll give you labels. I love it when they come at me with labels, because I then turn around and say, “Well, thanks for your label, because it shows that you don’t have the data and the argument to mount a case against my argument. So I win. If you had the data and the argument, you would come at me with the data and the argument. But you don’t. Instead, you come at me with labels, neo-Nazi, racist, xenophobe, misandrist, misogynist, far-right extremist, far-left extremist, call me whatever you want. It just reinforces that you don’t have the data.”

Malcolm Roberts:

So that’s the way they try to control, and they try and suppress discerning voices by calling us climate deniers. Not evidence, climate deniers. What you see then is a very subtle coercion throughout our society that suppresses dissent, suppresses disagreement with the government. We also see the indoctrination of our school children starting from a very early age, starting from five years of age, talking to them about changing their gender. The whole agenda of the United Nations, and make no mistake, they’re the policies that are being implemented in our country often bypassing parliament, going through the bureaucracy, their policies are based upon destroying the two fundamental structures of human society. One is the nation state. That is the best form of structuring in human society on a global basis. Independent sovereign states that are not necessarily united, but they’re united within their borders.

Malcolm Roberts:

But then the second form of basic human organisation is the family structure. It is the most important of all. And they’re deliberately destroying the family structure by destroying the family itself. They’re saying to people, “Same sex marriage.” They’re saying to people, “You can change your gender anytime.” They’re doing so many things to corrupt the minds of our kids. The kids then don’t have an anchor to go to. They destroy the family so that they don’t have the family to go to for support. When people don’t have a family structure, they turn automatically to the government. That makes them dependent on the government.

Malcolm Roberts:

What they’re also doing is telling us that humans are evil, humans are greedy, humans are irresponsible, humans are uncaring. That is completely wrong. It is completely against the truth. We know that we’ve had humans throughout history who have tried to control us. We’ve had humans who have been bullies and brutal, but we know the vast majority of humans are wonderful, caring people. We’re the only species on this planet who when we realise we are destroying an area will actually stop ourselves and change it and protect that area and care for that area. We’re the only species that has got a neocortex and a caring nature from our heart that enables us to be both intelligent and used data and used logic, and at same time apply that in a very caring way. The only species.

Malcolm Roberts:

We are the most advanced species on this planet, and we should be respecting ourselves while at the same time recognising that the human condition causes some people, many of whom are in the United Nations and many of whom are in parliament, to want to control others. That’s a fundamental weakness in the human being, that some people want to control.

Hrvoje Moric:

I would just add on the ad hominem attacks. I don’t think it’s working anymore, these labels of conspiracy theorists, climate denier, and anti-vaxxers today. It’s not working. A lot of people don’t buy it anymore. I’ve been called the same as well. I’ve been mentioned and had pieces in the press. Funny you mentioned that, because just this morning, I received a message from a journalist from a national newspaper to ask permission to use one of my podcast interview stills of an interview I did with a past guest. They’re preparing a hit piece on this person, and I notified them, but that’s because we’re becoming a threat. We’re telling the truth. We’re honestly looking to uncover what the truth is. And so just like yourself, I don’t care what I’m called anymore. Finally, I guess, my last question for you-

Malcolm Roberts:

Can I just interrupt there, please, Hrvoje. Always beneath control there is fear. If someone is wanting to control you, control me, lie about me, smear me, ridicule me, it tells me they’re trying to control people’s opinions of me. They’re afraid of me. Why are they afraid of me? I’m only about 165 centimetres, probably shrinking, I’m tiny, I only weigh… What is it? 65 kilogrammes. 65. Yeah. So there’s not much of me. Why are they trying to do this to me? Why are they trying to do it to you? Because they want to control us. They fear us. They fear the people. They fear the people. They impose censorship, which in another form of control. They impose restrictions, which is another form of control. Because they’re afraid of the people waking up. Again, liberty begins with you, and what they try to do is to suppress, and wherever there is suppression, that is a form of control. It is no less effective than me holding a gun to your head. But, we need to stand up and make people aware of this. So that’s why I want to thank you for what you’re doing, because you’re helping people to wake up.

Hrvoje Moric:

Yeah. I’ve had a gun held to my head, and that wasn’t fun. Is there any other issue you want to mention that’s front and centre on your mind these days, or any final thought to leave us with?

Malcolm Roberts:

I’ll just reinforce what I just said. I used to say the third biggest scam was the climate scam, to give a few control over others. It may be now the fourth biggest scam. The third biggest scam is the exaggerations and the derailment over COVID, and the control that that have been brought in. The second biggest scam is the banking scam, the Federal Reserve Bank, the printing of money, [inaudible 00:47:06] currency to control people. The biggest scam of all is the anti-human scam. The scam perpetrated by the club of Rome, the United Nations, World Wildlife Fund, Prince Philip, Prince Charles, Boris Johnson. Many of these people who use the term build back better, many of these people who want to reset the great reset, many of these people who want unelected socialist, global governance, they’re perpetrating the biggest scam of all, the anti-human scam.

Malcolm Roberts:

We are infecting, polluting, destroying the hearts and minds of future leaders because the governments led by these people are going into primary schools, secondary schools, universities filling them with basically bullshit, and anti-human bullshit, and saying that humans are uncaring, greedy, rapacious, irresponsible, worthless. We are not. I implore people to realise, when you step back and you look at the Hitlers and the Stalins and the Boris Johnsons and the Joe Bidens, and you look at the Scott Morrisons wanting to impose control, stand back and say, “We need to stand up to that.” But also stand back, look through that, and say, “The rest of us, many, many, many billions of us, are wonderful humans and just need the opportunity to be freed.

Malcolm Roberts:

I’ve got eight traits that I won’t go through now, but I’ve got eight traits that are essential for human progress; improving lifestyle, improving longevity of life, improving health, improving safety, improving material comfort, improving material welfare, improving standard of living. The most important is the first, freedom. And it goes back again to what’s over your left shoulder, liberty begins with you.

Hrvoje Moric:

All right, the website is malcolmrobertsqld.com.au. And people can find you on all of the big tech platforms for now. Is there any other website or project we should know about?

Malcolm Roberts:

No, no, that’s it. Yeah, that’s it.

Hrvoje Moric:

All right. Senator, keep up the good fight out there in Australia. We need more of you. Again, thank you for being on Geopolitics & Empire.

Malcolm Roberts:

Thank you very much, it’s been a pleasure. And Hrvoje, thank you for what you’re doing because the legacy media is censored and is controlling. This social media is actually antisocial media. The independent media, the truth media, which is what you are, you are the only salvation for spreading the word now. Thank you very much for what you do.

Hrvoje Moric:

I hope you enjoyed this Geopolitics & Empire podcast interview. The website is geopoliticsandempire.com. I encourage you to sign up for the free email list through which you can receive an update of every new podcast, as well as a long list of key news headlines once a week. We’re being heavily censored. YouTube has deleted some of our videos, and we currently have one strike. Patreon has terminated our account. Facebook has restricted our page, and Reddit has been the deleting posts. Our favourite social media channels are Telegram and Twitter. The best places to watch the podcast, beyond YouTube, are on Odyssey, BitChute, and Brighton. The best places to listen to the podcast are on SoundCloud, Apple, Spotify, Google, or on any other podcast app. To help keep this podcast alive, leave a review on Apple Podcasts and wherever else, subscribe to all our platforms, and leave a donation, if possible, via SubscribeStar, PayPal, Bitcoin, or Ethereum. You can also find us on MeWe, Minds, Gab, Float, VK, LinkedIn, and Instagram. Thanks for listening.

House prices are skyrocketing out of the average battler’s budget. Despite warnings of a possible housing bubble, APRA is banking on the banks only losing 2% from their mortgage books in their “stress testing”. This threshold sounds very favourable to the banks and allows them to get greedy at the possible expense of Australian homeowners.

Transcript

Stress testing banks during COVID-19 dated 15th of December, 2020. I have a question about one of the criteria APRA uses to stress test a bank, and that is a fall in real estate prices or to use a simple explanation, the ability of a bank to maintain liquidity during a real estate meltdown. Can I say it like that?

Well, I think Senator, it’s more a question of whether they can sustain their solvency, which for us it’s more of an issue of a capital, but liquidity is an important consideration as well.

Thank you. From the report, the figure APRA used as a proxy for a real estate meltdown was the loss of $49 billion in residential mortgages over three years. Is that correct?

That sounds about right, I think Senator. I don’t have the document in front of me, but-

That’s what I’m reading. Thank you. And with that loss being 30% of the total bank loss in the period of the stress test, as a loss rate, this would translate into 2% of Australian banks residential mortgage loan book. Is this correct? And please confirm your figure for the value of residential mortgages held by Australian banks. What is it?

Oh, well I think the, now I think the, if we’ve published that number, Senator, I’m quite comfortable to correct, total mortgages the banking system would be-

In the term of residential mortgages.

Yeah. Sorry. Total residential mortgages. Housing loams We’re talking about here. Owner-occupiers and investors would be, it’s in the order of a trillion dollars, I think Senator that’s something that we can come back to you on.

Thank you for that.

Very happy to take it on notice.

Okay. Thank you. Final question on this topic before moving onto a simple topic, can I confirm that APRA is projecting a real estate meltdown would only cost our banks $49 billion in losses on mortgages, and that loss would accrue over three years? That seems to be a very favourable assumption for the banks.

Well, that’s the, that’s the impact that we expect to have on the bank given they have collateral against their loans. Many loans have very low loan-to-value ratios. So in many cases of banks we have loans that even with a substantial fall in real estate values the banks would incur no loss, that’s not to say the borrowers would be unaffected by any means.

Well, I think that’s the concern. Sorry, go ahead.

Senator, I was going to add, I mean, it’s just to your question of projection or forecast, this is stress test. So, it is a set of assumptions that we use to look at the resilience of the sector and the entities involved. So, it’s not forecast or projection.

Okay. Thank you. It’s just that our constituents are concerned that we’ve had 20 years of the banks putting a lot of money into real estate, and taking it away from small businesses and funnelling it into real estate. And we’ve seen real estate prices increase a lot recently. Some people are calling it a bubble. So basically the question amounts to, are you letting the banks do as they please, and then sweetening the impact for the banks?

Well, Senator we don’t allow the banks to do what they please. We’ve got a raft of prudential standards that ask the banks as they’re making commercial decisions to take risk into account, and where we see risks, and I think an example of that would be the recent increase in the buffer, APRA acts and takes action.

Okay. Thank you.

I can just note for the record that, Mr. John Lonsdale was the one who provided that answer. Just leading into your next question.

Does APRA embed staff in financial institutions, like say the Big Four banks?

[Byres] No.

Okay. Thank you. Thank you.

Despite their name, free trade agreements are never free. These agreements always come at a cost to someone, and that’s usually everyday Australians, workers and business owners. Once signed into existence, these agreements are not subject to sufficient scrutiny.

Transcript

As a servant to the people of Queensland and Australia, I say that One Nation supports fair trade agreements. Is the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership agreement the spawn of the Trans-Pacific Partnership? Is it free trade or fair trade? It’s certainly not free trade. Each of the signatories have carved out substantial areas of their economies from the agreement. This information is tucked away, hidden away in annexes where it would seem not enough have looked. Tariffs are being defended. Schemes that protect the power base of local politicians are being defended, at Australia’s cost. There are hundreds of pages of carve-outs in this agreement. Many of them are ours. That’s probably a good thing. But the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership agreement is not a free trade agreement. It is at best slightly freer trade.

In the Productivity Commission submission dated July 2022 to the inquiry of the Joint Standing Committee on Treaties into certain aspects of the treaty-making process in Australia, the Productivity Commission comes out and basically supports what I’m about to say. The government prepared a national interest analysis on the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership agreement and found it did provide a net benefit to Australia. This was relied upon by the Joint Standing Committee on Treaties and subsequently endorsed by the Morrison-Joyce government and the alternative Albanese-Bandt government. This consensus of the establishment parties is disconcerting. Despite their name, free trade agreements are never free. These agreements always come at a cost to someone, and that’s usually everyday Australians, workers and business owners. Underdeveloped countries do not sign free trade agreements with industrialised nations in order to give away what they have. It’s the industrialised nations that give away their wealth, our wealth, through lower tariffs, greater market access of cheaper goods and greater incursion of foreign workers into our Australian economy. They’re facts.

Free trade in this situation is a race to the bottom. The nation with the worst environmental protections, the lowest wages, the worst working conditions, the crudest and most unsafe working conditions will win every time, in effect dragging our conditions down at the same time as dragging theirs up. Our environment loses. Our wages lose. Everyday Australians lose.

I saw nothing in the National Interest Analysis that constituted a genuine attempt to identify who the winners and losers will really be. That’s probably a design feature to allow the establishment parties to take all the electoral gain and protect themselves later from any electoral loss in this election cycle, because all too often in this country, in this parliament, it seems to be about looking good, not doing good.

Once signed into existence, these agreements are not subject to sufficient scrutiny. The last Productivity Commission inquiry into a free trade agreement was in 2010. The last review into Australia’s most important free trade agreement, the China-Australia Free Trade Agreement, was in 2018. Before Australia enters into future trade agreements, this parliament must address the lack of transparency in the trade negotiation process and the signing of an agreement before this parliament ratifies it.

My next concern is to the new regulatory environment that this agreement will create. In his submission to the Joint Standing Committee on Treaties, Bryan Clark from the Australian Chamber of Commerce and Industry highlighted: ‘There are five separate trade agreements with Malaysia. Businesses are getting very confused trying to work out how to use these agreements, and the best outcome for Australian business would actually come from sorting out all this red tape and creating clear rules for Australian businesses.’ I agree completely.

Here’s a specific example of this, thanks to the Australian Fair trade and Investment Network. The United Nations Central Product Classification system used by the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership agreement— with the UN it’s always a mouthful, isn’t it; they twist and turn and hide and bury and camouflage in acronyms and long titles that confuse people, so I’ll start again. The United Nations Central Product Classification system used by the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership agreement has a separate classification for aged care, which implies that without a specific reservation by Australia any increase in the regulation of aged care would be a breach of this agreement. So if we find something we need to improve and regulate it, it could be a breach of this agreement. The NSW Nurses and Midwives’ Association agreed that: ‘At worst, aged care is exposed to the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership agreement. At best, there is sufficient ambiguity to allow overseas companies to exploit the framework for their own benefit.’ The globalists, the elites, moving our industries—whole industries, whole sectors, workers, farmers—as pawns in their game of ‘central’, of control and money, and parliaments in this country, without accountability, are their tool. They work through us—this parliament.

The government has responded that there is provision for a review of unexpected consequences so we should not worry aged-care standards will drop under the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership agreement. There is, though, no framework in place to ensure this action actually occurs. In the years ahead, we will read stories that the parliaments’ mates, be they union bosses or crony capitalists and globalists, are exploiting loopholes in the Regional Comprehensive Economic Partnership agreement for their own benefit. That’s how they get through unaccountable parliaments. Resolving that will be at the discretion of the minister. This is a terrible system. The benefit of a free-trade agreement must be tested annually. I call on the government to introduce a system of annual review of the economic gains and losses for each of the agreements. Australia will not restore its position as a leading world economy by exposing Australian businesses to unfair competition and multiple layers of red, green and blue tape. Red tape is the bureaucracy. Green tape is pseudo-environmental regulations, impositions, under the guise of environment but really with the intent to control. And blue tape is UN policy on behalf of the UN’s masters, the globalists, who move industries and people around the globe at will.

Australia will not emerge from our self-inflicted COVID-19 recession by destroying business and increasing reliance on government welfare. To restore the wealth of everyday Australians, we must get the government out of the way and let personal free enterprise create wealth again. Ideas, effort, energy, heart—that’s what brings life to an economy when it is a free economy with fair trade. Fair trade has an important role to play in that process—fair trade.

Governments have been making policy that is completely out of touch with reality or data for decades. It’s all based on political whims or looking good, not the facts or data. As a result, our country is broken.

We have to return to policy based on tested data, not Labor or Liberal’s feelings on the day.

Transcript

As a servant to the people of Queensland and Australia, I will discuss the cost of shoddy science that is crippling people, families, communities and our nation. One Nation has repeatedly called for and continues to call for an independent office of scientific integrity and quality assurance to assess the science claimed to be underpinning government policy and decisions. We want objective, independent scientific scrutiny that is protected from politicisation. Science is a not a label; it is hard, verifiable, reliable data within a framework that proves cause and effect logically. It is every senator’s responsibility to ensure that she or he makes decisions using such data.

I’ll give you some examples of the cost of shoddy science that has not been scrutinised. Climate policies and renewable subsidies cost Australian households via electricity costs $13 billion per year, every year. That’s $1,300 per household per year needlessly wasted. The median income in this country is $49,000. After tax, that’s around $34,000 or maybe a little bit higher. How can someone on $34,000 after tax afford $1,300 flushed down the toilet, for nothing? The additional costs of climate policies on our power bills is a staggering 39 per cent, not the 6½ per cent that the government claims. Renewables distort the low cost of coal based power and more than double the wholesale electricity price from coal’s $45.50 per kilowatt hour to $92.50. China and India use our coal to sell electricity at 8c a kilowatt hour, while we burn the same coal without transporting it thousands of kilometres and the price of electricity from the coal is three times as much at 25c an hour.

All Australians have the right to benefit from our rich natural resources. The true cost of electricity in this country would be $13 billion per year less if cheap, affordable, reliable coal production was not lumbered with policies that distort the market. We commissioned independent expert and respected economist Dr Alan Moran to calculate those figures, and he used the government’s own data. So it can’t be sensibly refuted. The government stopped presenting it in consolidated form to hide what government policy is doing to everyday Australians in our nation.

Every subsidised green energy job or so-called renewable job, from renewable or unreliable power, such as wind and solar, costs 2.2 jobs lost in the real economy. Parasitic unreliables are killing their host, the people of Australia and the people of Queensland.

We can go further, beyond raw data on energy costs, to look at property rights. Property rights have been stolen in this country in the name of the Kyoto Protocol. John Howard’s Howard-Anderson government started it with Rob Borbidge’s National Party government in Queensland, followed quickly by Peter Beattie’s government and every government since, with the exception of Campbell Newman, who failed to repeal it. Property rights have been stolen with no compensation. That is fundamentally wrong. We see it in water policy, with corruption in the Murray-Darling Basin when it comes to water trading. We see the stealing of water rights, all based on shoddy science. The whole Murray-Darling Basin Plan is based on shoddy science—political science. Instead of having science based policy, we now have policy based science, and both sides of this parliament are responsible.

Senator Carr, who I have a lot of regard for in many ways, raised COVID. We have not been given the scientific data on COVID. We’ve been given models. The scientific data which I got from the Chief Medical Officer points to a completely different picture and to completely different management. COVID is being mismanaged in the name of science. It is wrong. By the way, the costs of all of those examples I’ve given are not in the billions but in the tens or hundreds of billions, and the impact on our country’s economy is in the trillions, with the lost opportunity and the lack of competitiveness.

COVID exposed to us that our country has lost its economic independence. We now depend on other countries for our survival—for basics. We’ve lost our manufacturing sector because of shoddy governance from the Labor, Liberal and National parties over almost eight decades, since 1944. In the last 18 months, we’ve seen the Liberals, Labor and the Nationals squabbling at state and federal level, because there is no science being used to drive the plan. There’s no plan for COVID management. Each state is lurching from manufactured crisis to manufactured crisis, and the federal government is bypassing the Constitution and conditioning them to suck on the federal tit. That’s what’s going on.

Let’s have a look at the science. I have held CSIRO accountable at three presentations from them, plus Senate estimates. Firstly, the CSIRO has admitted under my cross-examination that the CSIRO has never said that carbon dioxide from human activity is a danger—never. We asked them: ‘Who has said it? Politicians told us you said it.’ They said, ‘You’d have to ask the politicians.’ Secondly, CSIRO has admitted that today’s temperatures are not unprecedented. I’ll say that again—not unprecedented. They’ve happened before in recent times without our burning of hydrocarbon fuels.

Thirdly, the CSIRO then fell back on one thing—one paper, after almost 50 years of research, that said that the rate of warming is now increasing. That too was falsified by the author of that paper. It was falsified and contradicted by other references which the CSIRO had to then give us. There is no evidence for the CSIRO’s sole claim that the rate of temperature rise is unprecedented. Its own papers that it cites do not show that. The CSIRO then relied upon unvalidated computer models that were already proven to be giving erroneous projections. That’s what the UN IPCC relies on. They’ve already been proven wrong many times.

The clincher is that, to have policy based upon science, you would need to quantify the amount of impact on climate variables such as weather: rainfall; storm activity, severity and frequency; and drought. You’d need to be able to quantify the impact on that of carbon dioxide from human activity. The CSIRO has never quantified any specific impact on climate, or any climate variable, from human carbon dioxide.

With us, the CSIRO has repeatedly relied on discredited and poor-quality papers on temperature and carbon dioxide. It gave us one of each, and then, when we tore them to shreds, they gave us more. We tore them to shreds. It has never given us any good-quality scientific papers. That’s their science. The CSIRO revealed little understanding of the papers they cited as evidence. That’s our scientific body in this country—they could not show understanding of the papers that they cited.

The CSIRO admits it has never done due diligence on reports and data that it cites as evidence. It just accepts peer review. What a lot of rubbish that is! That has been shown in peer-reviewed articles to be rubbish. The CSIRO allows politicians to misrepresent it without correction. It doesn’t stand up—it doesn’t have any backbone. The CSIRO has misled parliament. Independent international scientists have verified our conclusions on the CSIRO science, and they’re stunned—people like John Christy, Nir Shaviv, Nils Morner, David Legates, Ian Plimer and Will Happer. There is no climate emergency—none at all. Everything is normal. It’s completely cyclical weather.

Now I’ll move to the UK’s Parliamentary Office of Science and Technology, which has turned into a propaganda outfit and a mouthpiece and cheer squad for global policies. Politics has captured it and turned it into a massive bureaucracy that writes legislation rather than checks it. POST, as it’s called, comprises people, as Senator Carr said, ‘consistent with parliamentary composition’. That tells us straight away that it’s not independent. Instead of a body to drive legislation we want a body to vet it. Senator Carr mentioned the Office of the Chief Scientist. I asked the Chief Scientist for a presentation on his evidence of climate change caused by human carbon dioxide. After 20 minutes of rubbish we asked him questions and he looked at us and said that he’s not a climate scientist and he doesn’t understand it. Yet we have policies around this country based upon Dr Finkel’s advice. Some of those policies that I mentioned are based on his advice.

We’ve had activists, such as Tim Flannery, David Karoly, Will Steffen, Ross Garnaut, Ove Hoegh-Guldberg, Matthew England, Kurt Lambeck, Andy Pitman and Lesley Hughes, being paraded and paid by the government—both Liberal and Labor—and yet they’re nothing more than academic activists. None have provided any empirical scientific evidence in a logical framework proving cause and effect. That’s what has been paraded around this parliament as science for decades now. It’s rubbish. That’s why One Nation opposes this motion. It is wasting committee resources to send them off on a goose chase to adopt something like the UK’s Parliamentary Office of Science and Technology.

We invite Senator Carr to join us in legislating for an independent body of scientists to scrutinise government policy and decisions. Let the government put up the science upon which its policies are based and let the independent body scrutinise it. That requires a few things. First of all, it needs a team funded and set up to oppose the government’s position, and we’ll let them both go at it. Science, fundamentally, is about data and debate. We need the government to put up its science and let a team tear it apart—and be funded to tear it apart. Once that happens, and the science is dismissed, that will save the country billions of dollars. If it withstands the scrutiny, that’s good—we’ll know we’ve got a really solid scientific case. Another way is to have a transparency portal. Put the science out there and let anybody in the public domain tear it apart. If someone finds a chink, fix it. True scientists are not about protecting their egos; they’re about being open to the advancement of humanity. They welcome their own science being torn apart.

We need an independent view. The type of information, as the motion discusses, is simple. All we need is empirical scientific evidence in a framework proving cause and effect. We then need independent scrutiny, and I’ve given you two examples. That will replace policies—as Senator Carr has discussed, and I agree with him—based on ideology, headline-seeking, prejudice, opinions, looking after vested interests and looking after donors. This is what’s driving this country, and the people are paying for it. They’re paying for it through the neck, and we’re destroying our country. We need the ‘claimed’ science to be scrutinised and verified or rejected.

What a shameful, disgraceful incident we saw in this parliament just after midday today. We saw Senator Wong, Senator Watt and Senator Waters engaging in a screaming match. Not once did anyone raise empirical scientific evidence. This is day 701 since I asked the chief proponent of this climate change nonsense in the parliament to be accountable for her data. I asked Senator Waters. I challenged her 701 days ago—almost two years ago. I challenged her 11 years ago. She has never agreed to debate me. She refuses to debate me. She refuses to put up the scientific evidence. She refuses to discuss the corruption of climate science. Yet she espouses policies that will gut this country. Also, we’ve seen Senator Wong quoting a report from the IPCC. That’s not a report from scientists; that’s a report from political activists. She talks about what we are told—insert the catastrophe—will happen in the future. That’s not science. What we need is an honest debate. We need an honest debate to reveal the pure science and to hold people accountable in the parliament. We will not be supporting this motion because it will encourage politicisation.