I’ve got many developments to give you on the World Health Organisation’s proposed Pandemic Treaty (now “Accord”) and International Health Regulations.
The draft has changed, now we must focus the fight on the final version of the Accord.
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We are seeing more conflicts across the world, from Gaza to Mexico to China, because enemies feel more emboldened when there is weak leadership in the United States. They know they can push the boundaries more than they could before.
Expect to see more of it under a Biden administration. I hold grave concerns with how far China will push the boundaries to take advantage of the weak leadership in the US.
Transcript
[Gary Hardgrave] Well, I think that’s right. I mean, look Malcolm Roberts we’re not going to spend the whole hour talking about Israel, but it’s awful with dozens of people on both sides of the border. When it comes to that Gaza strip aggression into even downtown Jerusalem, they have this Iron Dome of protection, missiles that basically blow up missiles out of the ground… out of the sky.
You know that this is ugly, but Israel is a democracy. Israel is the only democracy in the whole of the Middle East. Israel is worthy of defending. But equally the Palestinian claim on the territory is worth, you know, discussing but surely there’s room for both to live peacefully? If only they’ll give peace a chance.
[Malcolm Roberts] Yes. That’s the first thought that came to my mind when you raise this topic, Israel is indeed the only democracy in the middle East and it needs to stay. And then the Palestinians also have a right to exist. So I don’t think that’s, disputed by sensible people but what you do see when leadership fails, then you start seeing ill discipline coming in and aggression coming because they know there’s less-
[Gary Hardgrave] That’s it.
[Malcolm Roberts] -possibility of a consequence. And look at, look at the Mexican border. Now with the United States people pouring through. Texas now suing. So I read somewhere, Texas suing the Biden administration for being Lax on the border. I mean, it’s all going to custard and what worries me is what the Chinese will do with regard to Taiwan and what the Chinese might do with regard to us when they see a very weak leadership in the what is supposed to be the biggest and most powerful democracy that’s ever existed.
And it’s crumbling, we can see that the United States has really gone South. Thanks to Bill Clinton. Thanks to Barack Obama in particular. There was hope when Reagan was in and there was a lot of hope when Trump was in, but the globalists have taken over and they’re gutting that country. And so we’ll see all the tyrants and the and the despots taking over and playing the games that they can get away with now.
[Gary Hardgrave] Yeah, I think really what’s going on. And it’s awful. As I said, innocent children being killed. Conflict that doesn’t need to be there, is occurring. There is room for everybody to live peacefully. Side-by-side different religions. As I said, Holy land for Jews, for Christians, for Muslims for the Abrahamic faith. Everyone. The people of the book.
And the good sensible Muslims I know, passionate about Palestine understand that, respect that but they also understand that there’s a lot more in common with Jews and Christians, than these sorts of crazy extremists are promoting.
Australian banks hand over a large amount of sensitive banking and financial data to the United States IRS. This happens through the FATCA Act. Despite the huge intrusion to privacy and information of Australian citizens, no privacy impact statement was ever prepared for the Act.
The government has also failed to negotiate mutual recognition of retirement instruments like 401Ks in the US and super in Australia, meaning dual citizens are double taxed. This will only cost Australian taxpayers more as retirement funds are lost to US taxes.
Transcript
[Chair]
As well, Senator Roberts.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Thank you chair. Thank you for attending again. I want to talk about, oh, ask questions about FATCA, which for people on the committee, who don’t understand. In implementing the US Foreign Account Tax Compliance Acts, that’s FATCA, in Australia. One major group of stakeholders has been ignored from the very beginning. They’re the individuals, typically dual Australian and US citizens. Whose financial data is being reported to a foreign government. So this goes beyond the question of, why are we reporting data on Australian citizens to a foreign government? But it goes into the specifics of FATCA. In drafting the post-implementation review of FATCA, did treasury consider the impact on those Australians whose accounts were being reported to the internal revenue service in America?
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
I got to take that on notice.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay. Thank you. If not, why did treasury decide that this group of Australians were not significant stakeholders in the Australian implementation of FATCA?
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
So Senator I’m happy to provide whatever information we can on that conservancy US initiative.
[Malcolm Roberts]
It is and it’s hurting dual citizens all around the world because United States is the only country I understand that taxes on citizenship basis. Whereas every other country, taxes on residency. So an Australian citizens-
[Chair]
You can understand from the official’s point of view, it’s difficult for them to answer on the policy of another country. So perhaps-
[Malcolm Roberts]
This is to do with reporting.
[Chair]
I understand-
[Malcolm Roberts]
Under that policy,
[Chair]
But perhaps look keep going with your line of questioning, but it might pay if we can put these on notice and then at least give the officials the chance to consider this in some more data,
[Malcolm Roberts]
Some of them, they will have to be taken on notice, I accept that at the time.
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
Maybe just one context about the interaction of FATCA which is indeed another country sovereign, right And their sovereign, as you point out they tax they’re citizens on a different basis from pretty much every other country. I think there’s maybe one or two others, who tax on a citizenship basis, not developed countries. That FATCA was designed in a way that it would penalise, let’s say if the Australian government did not collaborate, did not interact at all with the FATCA system. It was designed in a way to force other countries banks to report the data with a penalty tax of 30% on all their US earnings, which would effectively stop those banks from actually operating in the international banking system. It was a very strong unilateral measure. The Australian government and many other governments negotiated to try to mitigate that through in a sense providing some of the information or in a sense agreeing to be a conduit for some of that information from domestic banks to the US government, primarily to save domestic banking industry from this measure. So it’s the consequence of the Australian government. Not, in a sense having that information flow would be, there’d be a 30% withholding tax on pretty much all the US source income of Australian organisations.
[Malcolm Roberts]
I’m aware that it’s blackmail. So let’s continue asking questions and what has to come on notice, but I thank you for that clarification. What was the number of accounts and aggregate values reported to the American internal revenue service in the fact that data sent by the ATO in September 2018 September 2019 and September 2020. You’d have to taken it on notice
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
I’ll probably take that on notice but if you give me one second, I might just clarify
Yes senator, I’m going to have to take that on notice
[Malcolm Roberts]
Thank you. Of these accounts how many were held by Australian residents? I imagine you have to take that on a notice too how many were under the United States dollar 50,000 minimum reporting threshold?
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
So again.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Yep were there any accounts reported by institutions that qualify as local client base banks under the FATCA agreement? So this one, you probably third question I have is how are account holders informed that firstly their data is being sent to the internal revenue service or secondly the amounts being reported under FATCA? What opportunity do account holders have to correct the information reported about them to a foreign government?
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
So Senator, I’ll take those on notice but primarily the relationship of the account holder is with their bank who first provides the information to us which we then on provide.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Yep.
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
And so many of those the notification points will be matters between a bank and its clients. I would say that the clients would generally be, I would expect would almost universally if not universally be advised that they are a person with US indigene and be asked for more information to clarify their US potential status
[Malcolm Roberts]
Which raises more questions. But anyway, that’s not for now, thank you for that. Why wasn’t a privacy impact statement, PIA conducted with regard to FATCA reporting and given the quantity of data being sent to foreign governments under both FATCA and the CRS the common reporting standard shouldn’t a privacy impact statement be conducted as soon as possible?
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
So Senator, look I’ll have to take that on notice, but I don’t think that’s
[Witness]
I think between the two of us we’ll take that on notice.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Is it acceptable for financial institutions doing business in Australia to deny accounts or otherwise discriminate against Australian individuals because of their citizenship or national origin?
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
So again Senator, I suspect that’s a matter for different specialists who specialise in discrimination matters.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Well, you’re discriminating because you’re, sorry the ATO is discriminating by sending that information by requiring it off certain individuals in Australia.
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
Sorry senator I was focusing on your question, which is should the bank be able effectively stop customer relationship? I mean, really that’s a matter for the bank and its and its discrimination law in terms of the information we receive, Yes we do share information with the US. We share information with many peragrando of common reporting standard, which is a multilateral solution. We do provide information to many other countries and also receive information from many other countries.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay. Thank you.
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
So the CRS is a two way so we’ve received both in and out for example, and again I don’t have the numbers with me but we received a lot of information about Swiss bank accounts, for example, under the CRS.
[Malcolm Roberts]
And the previous question was about the privacy impact statement. So what recourse do Australian individuals have when they are denied accounts due to their US citizenship?
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
Senator, I think that that would probably be a matter of for APRA or ASIC.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Last question Chair, FATCA reporting includes reporting on the Australian income of Australian residents, has treasury expressed their support of a same country, exception to FATCA as recommended by the US taxpayer advocate?
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
Is that a question of treasury?
[Malcolm Roberts]
Yes
[Jeremy Hirschhorn]
Senator, I’ll take that on notice.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay. Thank you. Just a final statement. This not only affects US residents, it affects Australians because we have to pay more of our tax to people in America who are Australians who have superannuation and have to go on the pension because they’d been taxed to the hilt by the Americans. There’s a dual taxation, so Americans get slugged, they have a different definition of superannuation than we do. So our superannuation accounts are taxed heavily because they happened to be Americans who had got dual citizenship. There’s a lot of cost involved in this for our country. Thank you very much.
Confidence in our elections is a cornerstone of our democracy and many questions have been raised by events in the United States Presidential election about our own software, which was originally sourced from the same supplier – Scytl.
Last night I asked questions of the AEC regarding the serious issues found in other audits by the Australian National Audit Office and the Australian Signals Directorate, as well as by leading University cryptographers.
The AEC replied that having purchased Scytl software they then chose not to use it, and have developed their own bespoke system. They claim this has been audited and the AEC had every confidence it worked.
One Nation feel bland assurances of this critical issue is not good enough. Today I will ask the Australian Signals Directorate, who are responsible for cyber security, if they have conducted a server-level and code-level audit of that software. If ASD haven’t, then who did the audit and what was the result?
Audits are normally done by the Australian National Audit Office and that agency has not audited the AEC. We need to know that this software is fit for purpose so the public, candidates and media can have complete confidence in our elections.
Transcript
[Chair]
Thank you, Senator O’Sullivan, Senator Roberts.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Thank you Chair, thank you for attending tonight. My questions should be pretty quick I think, in terms of going through them. I’ve got a number of them. Where are pre poll votes kept during the pre polling period and where are they counted?
I might ask the National Elections Manager to step forward.
[Assistant Commissioner]
First Assistant Commissioner, they are kept in a secure location within the polling booth. We have secure facilities that hold those while they’re not counted until after 6:00 PM on election night.
[Malcolm Roberts]
What percentage of pre-post centres have monitored back to base alarms and monitored surveillance cameras covering the location of the stored paper ballots?
[Assistant Commissioner]
I don’t have that on me, I’ll have to take notice.
We’d have to take that on notice.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Do any?
[Assistant Commissioner]
Pardon!
[Malcolm Roberts]
Do any?
[Assistant Commissioner]
I couldn’t answer right off here now.
[Tom Rogers]
There’s a whole range of security measures that are put in place including the involvement of scrutinies in every step of the process, signed documentation with numbered seals that can’t be cut and security guards, were security guards are required and a range of other measures that provide total security for all of those ballots. We treat that very seriously.
[Malcolm Roberts]
So the Senate first preference votes are counted in the polling place and then, to get a rough count. And then transported to the Senate scrutiny centre to be recounted, is that correct?
[Assistant Commissioner]
Correct.
[Tom Rogers]
That’s correct.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Do you compare the polling place count with the machine count?
[Assistant Commissioner]
We do.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Thank you. The 2013, how often or how, what sort of frequency, what sort of sampling?
[Assistant Commissioner]
The whole time. We manage those numbers all the way through to make sure that we’ve got the right… Are you’re talking about the… Well, sorry, there’s two parts to your question there. The first is that we always compare to the first count and we always see what we’ve done throughout the thing. I think what you’re asking there is how much sampling you just said?
[Malcolm Roberts]
Correct.
[Assistant Commissioner]
Right. We do do a portion of sampling throughout to make sure that it’s consistent.
[Malcolm Roberts]
What sort of portion, roughly?
[Assistant Commissioner]
I don’t have that on me. I have to take that on notice.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay, thank you. The 2016 Senate machine count was supplemented by a hand count. Did you compare the scanning accuracy with the manual count accuracy?
[Assistant Commissioner]
Great, so-
[Tom Rogers]
I might just start before Ms. White answers. It wasn’t supplemented, It’s actually part of the process, Senator. So it’s not a supplemented issue. What we’ve got is a manual count and a scanning process. The results of those are compared and where there’s no issues then that vote is then included in the count. It’s deliberately set up that way as a check mechanism. It’s not supplemented by. It’s actually one part of the-
[Malcolm Roberts]
Part of the process?
[Assistant Commissioner]
Yeah.
[Assistant Commissioner]
Correct.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay. Thank you. The software you use in the Senate scrutiny centre is sourced from Scytl.
[Assistant Commissioner]
No, it is not.
[Malcolm Roberts]
No. Who is it sourced from?
[Assistant Commissioner]
We, it is a bespoke system that we use within the AEC.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay thank you. I understand the AEC issued a contract to Scytl Australia to update the software between 2016 and ’19. Is that correct?
[Assistant Commissioner]
No.
[Malcolm Roberts]
There’s a Tender here.
[Assistant Commissioner]
Yeah, there is. So in 2016, when we had the short lead time to put this new scanning solution in, we had a number of tenders go out to see who could replace or upgrade the systems to be able to do the new process. They did try and do that but we ended up going with our internal process.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay, so the serious flaws found in the Scytl software in 2016 and in the 2019 New South Wales state audit. So I note that the 2016 audit found that admin passwords were left in during the election period, admin logs were not kept, software changed logs were not kept and the wifi was not disabled on the computers holding the votes.
[Tom Rogers]
I think you’re talking about the New South Wales.
[Assistant Commissioner]
Your New South Wales, that’s what it was.
[Tom Rogers]
I actually don’t wanna dispatch our New South Wales colleagues but I think you’re talking about the New South Wales state election and I-
[Malcolm Roberts]
We’ve got questions about that, yeah.
[Tom Rogers]
I think that’s what you’re referring to there.
[Malcolm Roberts]
So can you assure the committee that none of these errors affected the 2019 election in federally.
[Assistant Commissioner]
Well I can tell you it didn’t, because we didn’t use that software.
[Malcolm Roberts]
At all?
[Assistant Commissioner]
We’ve never used Scytl software for our election.
[Malcolm Roberts]
You’ve used your own bespoke system.
[Assistant Commissioner]
We have.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay. Dr. Vanessa Teague associate professor at the ANU college of Engineering and Computer science and Australia’s leading cryptologist was able to hack into the New South Wales Scytl server and change the votes in real time before they were passed through to the AEC server. Can this be done to the system you propose to use in the next federal election?
[Assistant Commissioner]
Nothing is plausible.
[Tom Rogers]
Just for the record, That’s not the AEC server, that was the New South Wales
[Malcolm Roberts]
New South Wales Again?
[Tom Rogers]
commission again. And we have sufficient measures in place that we’re satisfied with all the security measures that we have for the federal event and for the scanning of the Senate vote.
[Malcolm Roberts]
So Dr. Teague is Australia’s leading cryptologist. Would she be welcome to come back and do further audits?
[Tom Rogers]
Frankly, Senator, no. We’ve complied with, we work with a range of partners including the Australian Signals Directorate, the Australian Cyber Security Centre. We’ve had our internal code audited, checked and a range of other issues and not being rude, I’m sure that Dr. Teague is a wonderful person but we’ve had sufficient checks in place to assure ourselves that that system is running smoothly.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay. In Senate estimates on the 27th of February, 2018 in response to concerns raised about the audit software I think by Senator Farrell, Mr. Rogers, you made the following comment, quote “To the extent that I can be confident that nothing untoward happened. I’m very confident that nothing untoward happened and I am very confident the processes we’ve put in place.” That doesn’t sound like a resounding guarantee of the cyber integrity. Can you make an unequivocable guarantee of this as the sole assurance of the sovereign integrity of the software?
[Tom Rogers]
What I can tell you, Senator is that no one would sit in this chair and give an unequivocal guarantee about that issue. I would be cheapening the guarantee by giving it. What I’ve done very clearly is said to the extent that we’re aware and our partner agencies are aware, and the security agencies that we work with, we are satisfied with all the measures we have put in place. But no one is going to give you an unequivocal guarantee on that because there are unknown factors at play. But I am very, very, very confident that we’ve got an incredibly robust system in place that’s worked well and continues to work, and we continue to assess it. We continue to work with our partner agencies. We comply with all Commonwealth guidelines, cyber security guidelines. And I think it’s a fantastically secure system. I can’t give any stronger than that. If I said, I give you an unequivocal guarantee I don’t think anyone would give an unequivocal guarantee about anything, there are factors that I’m not aware of.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Well you’ve certainly lifted a burden from my mind with regard to Scytl. In 2016, it took 29 days to transport the completed ballot to the Senate Scrutiny Centre, you allowed apparently 18 days and it took 29. How long did it take in 2019 to get the ballots to the Senate Scrutiny Centre? And what is your projection for 2022?
[Assistant Commissioner]
So I’d have to take that on notice, and probably ask you to expand a little bit on that because we do a rolling transportational logistics of all our papers every day as they’re counted in our outpost of centres. We continually roll them through to our scanning,
[Tom Rogers]
Count them, all of them, send them off…
[Assistant Commissioner]
So it might take a total of 29 days to do all of those millions of ballot papers but they won’t take 29 days to get there.
[Malcolm Roberts]
So they take from each pre polling centre each day?
[Assistant Commissioner]
And each polling day output and into the output centre. And then they are rolled out and continually scanned through the whole process. If we waited till the 29th day you wouldn’t have a Senate result in time.
[Malcolm Roberts]
What sort of confidence do you have with regard to the integrity of the votes being preserved during that transfer.
[Tom Rogers]
Very high. We’ve got a whole system in place. We, as I said before, we’ve got specially designed boxes. Those boxes are secured by numbered seals that are witnessed at both sites. They’re counted in and out. They’re reconcile when they arrive at the Senate scanning centre-
[Assistant Commissioner]
Scrutineers can also-
[Tom Rogers]
Scrutineers are also involved in the process. It’s a good system, sir.
[Malcolm Roberts]
So you’ve got serial numbers recorded as they leave a pre polling place.
[Assistant Commissioner]
Yes.
[Tom Rogers]
That’s correct.
[Malcolm Roberts]
And when they arrive to the destination.
That’s correct. At the last Senate estimates in response to a question from Senator Farrell again on the AEC budget, Mr. Ryan made the statement that quote, “We are cognizant of the complex cyber environment that we operate in. At the moment we do a 24/7 manual look at security for cyber at election time. Could you please tell me what 24/7 manual look at security for cyber looks like?
[Assistant Commissioner]
Well…
[Malcolm Roberts]
What does it mean?
[Tom Rogers]
Well, I can tell you that. As I mentioned before, Senator, we are compliant with all Commonwealth cybersecurity guidelines. We are always, did it say Mr. Rogers or Mr. Ryan said this, by the way?
[Malcolm Roberts]
Mr. Ryan.
[Tom Rogers]
Mr. Ryan. What it means is that we are fully compliant with Commonwealth guidelines. We monitor our system at 24 hours a day like every other Commonwealth government department does to make sure that it’s safe and secure. And I think that’s what Mr. Ryan was probably indicating. It’s not so much a manual process that we do that in any case. And we’re always monitoring our own system. We’ve got good arrangements in place. We work with other Commonwealth security agencies to make sure our systems are monitored. And we’re very satisfied with the level of security we have on our system.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay. Thank you. I understand your software was approved by IBM in 2017 as having a likely error rate below 0.5%. Is that correct? And what was your error rate in 2019?
[Tom Rogers]
I might have to take that one on notice, I think Senator
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay. Thank you. 16.4 million ballots at 0.5% error rate indicates that up to 80,000 Senate votes nationally were recorded in error. Is that acceptable to the AEC?
[Tom Rogers]
I think I’d wanna look at the statistics of that before I answer Senator, I don’t think we have that here tonight so,
[Malcolm Roberts]
On notice?
[Tom Rogers]
Let me look at that.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Okay. Two more questions, Chair. What audit has been conducted on the software used in the Senate scrutiny centre including comparison of the accuracy of the scanned file against the original paper record and the accuracy of the routine use to allocate preferences?
[Tom Rogers]
I’ll take that on notice.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Thank you. In previous estimates… This is a different line of questioning. In previous estimates, the AEC has indicated that when a federal election follows a state election there is an increase in informal votes as voters vote federally in the manner they voted in the state election. That’s understandable. I note your testimony that the AEC spends extra time and money educating voters in those States. Can I ask if any consideration has been given to allowing the States to specify the voting technique for their own state and federal elections, which would remove this confusion for good? I’m not advocating it I’m just asking about it.
[Tom Rogers]
No.
[Malcolm Roberts]
No consideration? Thank you very much. Thanks Chair.
Thank you very much, Senator Roberts, your economy with your questioning is very much appreciated.
One Nation always aims to protect honest workers, protect small businesses and simplify our Industrial Relations (IR) system. The current IR reforms need a lot of work to achieve that.
Transcript
[Marcus Paul]
G’day, Malcolm.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Good morning, Marcus, how are you?
[Marcus Paul]
I’m okay. I’m just having a little chuckle at the wankfest going on in the United States at the moment. I get that it’s a momentous occasion. I understand every time a President’s inaugurated that they have to get celebrities up there to sing songs and carry on. But for God’s sake, enough’s enough, surely.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Yeah, I’ve travelled through all 50 American States. I’ve lived there for five years. I’ve studied at one of the top universities over there and I’ve worked over there in eight different states. And I love Americans. They’re absolutely fabulous people, but they’re different. You know, in many ways they look like us. They dress like us. They have similar habits, they’re casual and they’re formal like us, they love us. But mate, they just go over the top when it comes to celebrating things. it’s just for Australians, it’s too much.
[Marcus Paul]
Well, you’d think that there’s no issue with COVID-19. You’d think that America is all this, there’s no social inequality. You think that there’s no civil unrest. It’s all, I don’t know, look, I’m seeing right now the presidential motorcade with the military escorting Joe Biden back to the White House, the bloke looks like he needs a good lie down.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Yeah, it’s a contradiction in America. Wherever I went you can see contradiction. And, you can get a very energetic country like America but there are so many, so many inequalities as well. But there’s one thing that’s very strong in Americans and that’s the love of their country and their passion for freedom. And so, I think there’ll be a lot of Americans holding their breath right now.
[Marcus Paul]
All right, mate. Now you’re on the road driving down the New South Wales coast, you’re around Singleton, are you?
[Malcolm Roberts]
Yes, and what a beautiful day it is. I used to live in Singleton, worked here several times but it’s a glorious day and blue sky. We just driven up the Valley from Singleton. We’re now in Musswelbrook and we went past Bayswater and Liddell Power Station. It’s just absolutely beautiful.
[Marcus Paul]
Yeah, nice, now the federal government’s so-called industrial relations reforms, you’ve had a fair bit to say about that ahead of Senate estimates hearings in March.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Well, they’re going to try and bring in the legislation into the Senate fairly soon, it’s an inquiry at the moment but we’ve had a good look at it and we still got a lot more work to do on it. But Marcus, you know, our aims are always to protect honest workers, to protect small business. And, in this case, to restore productive capacity. And you know, the government is really just playing at this, it’s not addressing energy, it’s not addressing tax, it’s not addressing infrastructure, it’s not addressing over regulation. It’s still making life hard for people. It’s not a real reform at all, it’s just tinkering to look after his mates and the overriding thing with this so-called industrial relations reform, it’s not reform, it’s tinkering with the deck chairs on the Titanic is that their aim seems to be to not upset anyone and to try and please everyone. And whenever you do that, Marcus, you’re coming out of fear.
[Marcus Paul]
Yes.
[Malcolm Roberts]
And so they’re afraid. And that means the country will suffer. These regulations, they don’t simplify and small business badly needs that. The key aspect of this supposed reform from the Prime Minister is to get jobs, mate.
[Marcus Paul]
Yeah.
[Malcolm Roberts]
It won’t get any jobs. It’s just gonna make things more complex. There are some positives in there but there are overwhelmingly a lot of negatives. We’re just going to have to do a lot of work on this.
[Marcus Paul]
All right, now, obviously, on this trip down the coast you’ve been catching up with people who may have reached out to you, made contact, what are you hearing on the ground?
[Malcolm Roberts]
Well, first of all, I’ve got to say how beautiful the country is on the coast coming south down through New South Wales. It’s just green, it’s glorious. And people, I’ve heard from small business, for example, a guy who run, well, I won’t tell you his business because it’s a boutique business and I don’t want anyone to come back on him but he was really talking about how difficult life is under state, federal and local government. Because they’re making things complex.
[Marcus Paul]
Absolutely, could you imagine all that bloody red tape a business owner has to go through these days? It’s just, it’s almost —
[Malcolm Roberts]
But, Marcus, he was telling me things like if you get a permit from the state government to do something and then by the time you’ve finished dealing with regulations for the local government, the state government permits have expired and you’ve got to get it again. And that means more fees. And he was talking about 20, $30,000, I think, 50, $45,000 in one case, just to get consultants in to do the work for the local government. You can’t afford that.
[Marcus Paul]
No.
[Malcolm Roberts]
But one good piece of news. We visited a workshop here in Philly, a large workshop here, well, in Rutherford which is near Maitland. And they’re telling us, they do a lot of work for agriculture and mining machinery and they’re telling us that the price of coal has gone up quite a bit and they’re hiring again which is good for the Valley. And it’s really good for the whole Hunter Valley and Newcastle because most people don’t realise this but for every job in the coal mine there are six other jobs depending upon those jobs. And so the price of coal and the use of coal is extremely important to everyone in New South Wales.
[Marcus Paul]
Well, look, you know, you’ve got a bloke up there in the Hunter who is making a fair bit of noise. I’m sure he’s scaring the pants off of Joel Fitzgibbon but, I don’t know, if things are looking okay or a little better up there in the Hunter maybe Joel might hold on a little bit.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Well, the problem with Joel is his party. His party won’t let him do things. His party has got their foot on the throat of the coal industry and they’re determined to kill the coal industry. I mean, some of the senior people in the labour party have admitted that and said that is what they want to do. And it’s insane. One of the things I did coming down the New South Wales coast, I’m doing a bit of research in southern New South Wales in the next couple of days and I stopped in Port Macquarie and worked for a day and a half with an absolutely astounding Scientist there who’s been going through the Bureau of Meteorology records and mate, the records are just so shoddy and he’s done advanced statistical analysis. Once he’s removed all the the deliberate movements or adjustments. And there’s no warming at all going on. So, this whole thing about coal is just a beat up.
[Marcus Paul]
Yep, all right. Now, well, just on coal, of course, the Prime Minister, Scott Morrison, he’s had a lot to say. Oh, by the way, when you visit these places, do you don on your high vis shirt and you untuck the top of the collar just to show a little bit of chest hair, look all macho like you’re in the moment? And do you have your professional photographer tailing your every move for a photo opp, Malcolm? I’m just wondering.
[Malcolm Roberts]
No, that’s not me. What I’m doing is I’m driving by myself. This morning I’ve got some of my, one of my staff with me but I’ve been driving down the coast on my own. I make all my own arrangements. Take my own notes, I just listen to people because you can’t listen to people through others. You’ve got to listen by firsthand, direct.
[Marcus Paul]
Fair enough.
[Malcolm Roberts]
So, I don’t go for all that crap.
[Marcus Paul]
Well said. All right, mate, listen, we’ve got a listener Gail Thornton who follows the programme. We want you to say hello. Can you just do me a favour, say, good day, Gail. Hope you’re having a wonderful morning. Just say that for me.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Good day, Gail, hope you’re having a great morning.
[Marcus Paul]
See, Gail says on our Facebook page and I’ll have to tell you, you got a little bit of hate on our social media. Mind you, I get a lot of hate on my social media as well. That’s just what it’s all about. But your posts, when we re-share things that you know you and I have a chat about a certain issue, it’s one of the, this is what I don’t get, this is the hypocrisy with it all and on this programme, we will speak to anybody, labour, liberal, callithumpian, you know, we have Pauline, yourself and also Mark Latham. So, we listen to all sorts, we try to as much as we can. We would love to have the Prime Minister or the Premier on here, but they don’t even know we exist or they probably know we exist but their media people don’t want them to come on because they’re probably upset that I’ll- first question to the Premier would be, when are you going to resign? And the second question to the Prime Minister would be, do you take any responsibility for robo-debt? And what about the thousands of people that have possibly taken their lives? So, that’s why they don’t come on. But your stuff that we talk about is well-received, you know, you gotta have your haters for those to really like you, Malcolm, but Gail says, there’s no way that we will listen to anything Malcolm Roberts has to say. So, I just wanted you to say good morning to Gail. She’s one of your biggest fans, I think.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Well, tell her that I’ll be very happy to meet her. And I look forward to her giving me evidence that contradicts my arguments.
[Marcus Paul]
Well, that’s it. Good on you, mate. Always great to catch up, drive safely. You can’t drop by and visit us, I hear.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Not this time, I was wanting to do that and I’ve got two outstanding retired people in Sydney that I want to meet because they’re both very, very good on water. And that’s a critical issue for us but I was hoping to drop in. But if I go anywhere near Sydney, then, mate, I’ve got to lock up in quarantine in Brisbane when I go back. So, even if I just don’t get out of the car. I’ve just got to lock up. So, I’m going to drive through Mudgee and then that way down through Bathurst and then to Canberra that way, so it’s an extra drive but, hey, that’s the way it has to do.
[Marcus Paul]
Ah, look, we’re broadcasting out into those regions right now and it’s pretty good out there as well. You reckon it’s green on the coast. You should see it inland. It’s just gorgeous around 2MG Mudgee area and out to Bathurst to our station 2BS and out to Orange . I love it out there, mate. Look after yourself.
[Malcolm Roberts]
Thanks Marcus. We’ve got to look after this country and stop the wombats ruining it, the wombats in Canberra.
[Marcus Paul]
All right, mate, bye-bye. Malcolm Roberts, Marcus Paul in the morning.
Transcript
I serve the people of Queensland in Australia. Yet, I’ve lived, worked and studied for five years in the USA and travelled through all 50 states. And I know that under the United States Constitution, the declaration of the polls in a presidential election is not made by the media nor by political parties and certainly not the commentariat. The Declaration of the poll is made by each state legislature. Pennsylvania has ordered a recount. Other states will follow because state legislatures are committed to counting every legal vote. As of today, not one legislature has declared a result and several states have now been precluded from declaring due to legal challenges to voting irregularities. This election won’t be resolved for weeks, so congratulating former Vice President Biden is premature. Now I understand the greens are getting excited that a Biden or Harris presidency will advance the socialist green agenda. What will this socialist green agenda do to the United States? It’ll raise power prices as unreliable solar and wind energy expands and destroys baseload power generation wiping out small and medium businesses and heavy industry. Under President Trump, heavy industry returned to the United States and brought high paying breadwinner jobs back for American workers. The Democrats green new deal will destroy those jobs forever. Americans thrown out of work by green policies will be forced onto a subsistence allowance from the government for the rest of their lives. This the greens have euphemistically named a universal basic income and basic it will be. According to Stanford University, these policies will destroy 4.9 million jobs and reduce America’s GDP by 2.9 trillion US dollars every year of a Biden or Harris presidency. This is news to most people that I talked to which is a damning indictment of the news media. The presentation of news is worse than just fake news. Mainstream media has devolved to being propaganda. President Trump’s greatest achievements, have been ignored by fake news. So let me remind every one of these the lowest black unemployment rate in history the lowest Hispanic unemployment rate in history, the lowest female unemployment rates since World War II, the highest number of black led business startups in history, the highest number of female led business startups in history, the first president in 30 years to not start a new war, five Nobel Peace Prize nominations for peace deals. The socialist takeover of America will destroy these gains
And end in misery.
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Malcolm’s Fight
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