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Integrity in Parental Leave

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One Nation fully supports the heart of the Fair Work Amendment (Baby Priya’s) Bill 2025. Losing a child to stillbirth is a crushing, heartbreaking tragedy and parents deserve the full support of our paid parental leave system during such a dark time. We agree that no employer should be able to unilaterally cancel leave when a family is grieving.

However, I introduced an amendment to fix a serious flaw in the current drafting. As it stands, the definition of “stillbirth” would allow a woman who undergoes a voluntary late-term abortion to claim 26 weeks of taxpayer-funded parental leave.

Our position is clear: ✔️ YES to supporting parents through the tragedy of stillbirth or infant loss. ✔️ YES to protecting mothers who need emergency medical terminations for health reasons. ❌ NO to using taxpayer dollars to provide “parental leave” for elective abortions.

Paid parental leave is a benefit designed to support families and the bond between parent and child. It should not be extended to those who voluntarily choose to terminate a pregnancy.

I called on the Senate to support our common-sense amendment to ensure this bill serves its true purpose: supporting grieving families.

Transcript

The Fair Work Amendment (Baby Priya’s) Bill 2025 amends the Fair Work Act 2009 to extend entitlements to paid parental leave in the case of stillbirth or death of a child. Stillbirths or deaths of a child are crushing—heartbreaking to parents. My wife, Christine, and I have two children and one grandchild. Nothing else comes close, as I’m sure every parent feels. Nothing else comes close to having a child, except possibly losing a child. One Nation supports the bill’s core intent for the very reason I’ve just mentioned.  

The bill only deals with paid parental leave; it does not alter the existing provisions around unpaid parental leave. The bill will prevent employers from unilaterally cancelling periods of paid parental leave in cases of stillbirth or the death of a child during the paid parental leave period. The bill will not prevent employers and employees from agreeing between themselves to cancel such periods of leave, usually so the employee can return to work early for sound reasons. And the bill does not change arrangements for payment of allowances to parents who are not employed. The bill does not impose any requirement on employers to provide employer-funded paid parental leave, because the employer does not pay parental leave; the government does, at a cost of $2.9 billion a year. Some companies pay parental leave at a higher rate. Often, they pay the employee’s regular pay and top up the government payment themselves. In this case, the bill will make those employers pay this higher rate to an employee who voluntarily terminated their pregnancy when their child was delivered stillborn. I will say that again: in this case, the bill will make those employers pay this higher rate to an employee who voluntarily terminated their pregnancy when the child was delivered stillborn. 

Why has One Nation submitted an amendment to the Baby Priya bill? Why have I submitted an amendment to the Baby Priya bill? The bill requires employers to provide paid parental leave to employees who have a stillborn baby, or where the baby dies during the parental leave period. One Nation do not oppose this measure in principle; we support it. Our amendment does not change the outcome of the bill for most women, including the situation Baby Priya’s parents, very sadly, found themselves to be in.  

The definition of a stillborn baby in the bill relies on section 77A(2) of the Fair Work Act 2009, which defines a stillborn child as one: 

(a) who weighs at least 400 grams at delivery …; and 

(b) who has not breathed since delivery; and 

(c) whose heart has not beaten since delivery. 

Yet here’s a key concern of many constituents across Australia and my state of Queensland: nothing in this definition takes account of a voluntary abortion resulting in a stillbirth, which is most late-term abortions. These involve injecting the human baby with a drug that stops their heart and then is delivered as a stillbirth. In the bill as it was introduced, a mother in that situation would qualify for 26 weeks of paid parental leave. This is the very specific issue One Nation’s amendment seeks to correct. We do not believe it is right for a woman who deliberately terminates her pregnancy to then qualify for 26 weeks paid parental leave at taxpayer expense. I must emphasise that neither this bill nor One Nation’s amendment changes anything around emergency terminations in the event of serious health issues affecting the mother. Nothing changes. That’s already protected in legislation; I want to make that very clear. For example, early delivery without killing the baby first is normal obstetric practice for emergency health conditions late in pregnancy such as high blood pressure, liver or kidney disease or cancer that requires chemotherapy. 

Here are some more important facts on abortion that have informed One Nation’s amendment. There is no upper gestational limit on abortion in any Australian state jurisdiction—none. In each jurisdiction, abortion is permitted until birth with the approval of two doctors after a certain gestation. In some jurisdictions such as Queensland, the second doctor who approves the late term abortion is not even required to examine the pregnant woman. A late term abortion is an abortion at 20 weeks or more in gestation. This is consistent with the definition provided by the Royal Australian and New Zealand College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists in its practice guideline on late term abortion. 

How many late term abortions are performed in Australia every year? We don’t know because only Victoria, Queensland and South Australia publish the figures. The other states are obviously ashamed of how many they perform. The total number of known late term abortions in 2024 was 5,559. Of those, 75 per cent were for non-life-threatening conditions. This makes a complete mockery of the leftist talking point that women don’t abort their babies on a whim. Some do. 

There is a strong case for the productivity benefit of paid parental leave though, including in cases of natural death of the child. One Nation quite clearly supports this. It’s only the extension of this benefit to women who deliberately kill their baby, murder their baby, that One Nation objects to. I ask the Senate to support this amendment. 

In good conscience, we cannot wave through legislation that forces employers and taxpayers to fund 26 weeks of parental leave for terminated births or neonatal neglect.

While the loss of a child to natural causes is a tragedy, we are currently witnessing a horrifying reality in our hospitals: babies born alive after termination are being left to die alone in cold steel tins. This isn’t just a policy debate; it is a question of fundamental humanity.

Australia must stop and listen. We refuse to let this be treated as a tool for social media points or gender warfare. The Australian people deserve a formal inquiry to review these harrowing circumstances and have their voices heard.

Transcript

One Nation supports Senator Hanson-Young’s amendment. This bill will have far-reaching impacts on Australia. It’s not to be rushed through the parliament. One Nation is the party of the natural environment and the party of the human environment. We want to give Australians a say. Workers, employers and small businesses—the parliament needs to listen to these people and give them a say. 

I’d also like to now move my amendment to the Selection of Bills report as circulated in the chamber. 

The PRESIDENT: Senator Roberts, you can’t. We are dealing with Senator Hanson-Young’s amendment at this point. You can speak to your motion if you wish to, but you can’t move it. 

Senator ROBERTS: Thank you. I will speak to it now, and that’ll save us time later. One Nation has moved to send the Fair Work Amendment (Baby Priya’s) Bill 2025 to committee. The bill, as worded, allows employer paid parental leave for the parents of a baby who has been born still as a result of a termination or of a live birth abortion. Loss of a child due to natural circumstances is crushing, but where a child is terminated and born alive that child is cast away into a cold steel tin and left inhumanly to die from neglect in a bucket of cold steel. This is what’s going on our country. Alone, scared and suffering, the child dies a slow and terrifying death. 

This happens every few weeks in a hospital somewhere in Australia. The mother’s employer or the taxpayers should not have to foot the bill for 26 weeks paid leave for an aborted baby or neonatal murder—they should not. This is too important an issue to wave through parliament for social media likes and gender warfare points. A committee inquiry is needed to review this position and allow the public their say. The people of Australia need to have an opportunity to have their say, and we need to listen. 

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Aged Care: Rights, Not Rules

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In this session, I question the Aged Care Safety & Quality Commissioner on why some Commonwealth-funded aged-care facilities are banning family visitors without a legal or public health mandate. Many constituents are raising this issue, and I wanted to find out what was the lawful basis for these “operational discretions.”

I was pleased to get a direct admission from Ms. Metz that there is no legal basis under the Aged Care Act for a provider to unilaterally ban a visitor. In fact, the Act explicitly protects the resident’s right to have visitors.

The ACQSC confirmed that they view an unjustified visitor ban as a serious breach of residents’ rights.

I questioned why funding continues to flow to these providers while they are under investigation for unlawful bans. Ms. Hefren-Webb clarified that while they don’t control the “funding lever” (which sits with the Department), they do have the authority to pursue civil penalties and compliance notices.

It was concerning to hear from Mr. Day that the Department hasn’t issued explicit guidance to providers telling them they can’t use visitor bans as a lazy substitute for proper staff discipline or complaints management.

The Commission could not provide immediate data on visitor ban complaints or subsequent enforcement actions, and took these questions on notice.

We must ensure that our elderly are not isolated from their loved ones just because a provider finds a family member “difficult.”

– Senate Estimates | February 2026

Transcript

Ms Hefren-Webb: Hi, Senator.  

Senator ROBERTS: I think my questions are fairly straightforward, so we should be able to move through them pretty quickly. On what lawful basis does the ACQSC permit Commonwealth funded aged-care facilities to impose visitor bans where there is no public health order, no tribunal decision or no resident request?  

Ms Hefren-Webb: Can you just repeat that last bit of your question? Where do we allow them to impose visitor bans where there is no—  

Senator ROBERTS: No public health order, no tribunal decision or no resident request.  

Ms Hefren-Webb: I’ll have to take that question on notice. I think. Is there a specific circumstance you’re referring to?  

Senator ROBERTS: No—I don’t want to bring it up now but constituents are asking us. Does the ACQSC accept that a provider may unilaterally ban a family member as a matter of operational discretion? If so, where is that power derived from in law or regulation?  

Ms Hefren-Webb: I might ask Ms Metz to come forward who heads up our Sector Capability and Regulatory Strategy area. I am aware that there are cases where family members are alleged to have caused issues or disruption, and that’s been the subject of the service, maybe, seeking that they don’t attend, but I’m not aware of a ban per se. I’ll just see if Ms Metz has anything to contribute.  

Senator ROBERTS: What I’d like to know is where their power is derived from in law and legislation. 

Mr Metz: Under the Aged Care Act, residents have a right to visitors and people who are important to them. There’s no legal basis under the Aged Care Act for a visitor to be banned. In fact, it’s the opposite, that people have the right to have visitors. We often, through our complaints process, will work through some of those difficult issues that Ms Hefren-Webb mentioned, where providers have difficult situations with certain family members. We do work through those, with both the providers and the families, to resolve those issues.  

Senator ROBERTS: How many complaints has ACQSC received, since 1 January, relating to family or visitor bans in residential aged-care facilities?  

Ms Hefren-Webb: We would have to take that on notice.  

Senator ROBERTS: That’s fine. Of those complaints, how many resulted in enforcement action, compliance notices or findings of noncompliance with the aged-care quality standards?  

Ms Hefren-Webb: Again, we’ll have to take that one on notice.  

Senator ROBERTS: I can understand that. Does ACQSC consider the imposition of an unjustified visitor ban to be a serious breach of residents’ rights and if not, why not? I think you’ve already answered that.  

Ms Hefren-Webb: Yes, we would consider it to be a serious breach of rights.  

Senator ROBERTS: Is Commonwealth funding continued to providers while they are subject to unresolved complaints regarding unlawful visitor bans?  

Ms Hefren-Webb: We have complaints that cover a wide range of matters. Our focus is on working with the provider and the complainant and their family and carers to resolve those matters as quickly as possible, to make necessary restoration, if needed, to undertake mediation or other activities. We have no responsibility for the funding of the facilities. That’s the department. Our enforcement activities go to things like enforceable undertaking, civil penalties et cetera. There’s no direct link between if we consider that a provider has failed to respect someone’s rights and a funding lever. We would be taking action through other means.  

Senator ROBERTS: You have the authority to do that.  

Ms Hefren-Webb: Yes.  

Senator ROBERTS: Has the department of health issued any guidance to providers clarifying that visitor bans cannot be used as a substitute for proper complaints management or staff discipline processes?  

Ms Hefren-Webb: I’m not aware whether or not there’s been direct guidance on that matter. We can follow that up for you though.  

Mr Day: We haven’t provided explicit guidance on that specific issue. We have provided guidance on the impact of the statements of rights that came into effect with the new act, including, as Ms Metz indicated, the right to have access to individuals that are important to an aged-care resident.  

Senator ROBERTS: This is my last question, Chair. In the context of the new Aged Care Act and rights based reforms, what steps are being taken to ensure residents are not isolated from family due to provider convenience, disputes or risk aversion?  

Ms Hefren-Webb: We have a number of mechanisms by which we are assessing the extent to which providers are respecting the rights of residents. Obviously, complaints are one source of information that we can follow up on. We also receive reports—  

Senator ROBERTS: Those are complaints direct to you?  

Ms Hefren-Webb: Yes, that’s correct, as well as serious incident reports that come through to us. We also, as I mentioned before, undertake audits of all residential care facilities every three years. In that, we will be interviewing a number of residents, family members and staff to make sure that residents’ rights are being upheld and respected. We also receive anonymous complaints, tip-offs and whistleblowing. So there are a range of ways that those matters can come to our attention. If we were made aware that someone’s right to have family or friends or loved ones visit them was being impeded, we would take that extremely seriously.  

Senator ROBERTS: Where do you have offices around the country? If someone in Central Queensland made a complaint, how would you address it? Through the phone?  

Ms Hefren-Webb: Initially, we do address matters over the phone. But, if the matter raises significant safety concerns for us, we will send a team, and we can do an unannounced visit of a facility. We have staff who are trained to go and assess what’s happening, find out, investigate. Our staff are based in all the capitals around Australia. In that case, if it were Central Queensland, we’d send a team probably from our Brisbane based staff. 

Senator ROBERTS: Chair, I want to put on the record that I rushed my questions because of another deadline, but I want to acknowledge the three respondents. They’ve been very prompt and concise with their answers. Thank you very much.  

CHAIR: Thank you, Senator Roberts, for using your eight minutes very efficiently for us. That’s very generous of you today.  

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Australian Values Matter

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Australian values aren’t just words—they’re the spirit that runs through every Aussie heart.

Mateship means loyalty and giving everyone a fair go. Being fair dinkum means telling the truth and respecting real science—not opinions. Family is the foundation of our human existence, and our wonderful flag is more than just a symbol – it represents the spirit of our nation. Fairness, democracy and respect for others and our communities are core to who we are.

Freedom is fundamental. Freedom of speech, belief, movement, and life is non-negotiable. Australians value governments that protect life, property, and freedom—and then get out of the way.

It’s time we stood up and protected what makes Australia great.

Transcript

Australian values pronounce a spirit. They’re not tangible, but they’re there. They’re very strong. They run through every Australian’s heart. Let’s have a look at some of these. Mateship—what’s mateship? It’s giving people a fair go, you having a fair go yourself, and you supporting mates, as well as loyalty. Then it’s being fair dinkum—I hope the Greens take notice of this. That’s telling the truth and being open to science. Science is about objectivity and integrity, not opinion. Being fair dinkum means telling the truth on the science. Family is very important to Australians. It’s a fundamental building block and the organisation and structure of human existence. The flag—our wonderful flag—is the spirit of Australia. It’s not just a cloth; it conveys the spirit of the country. Fairness is another value that Australians hold dear. 

Then there’s freedom—freedom in many forms. Freedom of life and freedom to live is fundamental. Without that, there is nothing else that’s worth living for. There’s no other freedom. There is also freedom of belief; freedom of thought; freedom of faith; freedom of speech, which has been sadly trampled by both Labor and Liberal parties in the last five years; freedom of association, who I can be friends and mix with; freedom of exchange; freedom of movement and travel; and freedom to live free from government interference. Democracy is another value, as are care for each other, dependability, respect for people—not misinform people—respect for community, respect for the law, respect for environment. Australians value when governments stick to their three core responsibilities—protecting life, protecting property and protecting freedom—and getting the hell out of everything else. Our Constitution is another value that Australians hold dear, competitive federalism. The last one is that human progress and Western civilisation are to be cherished, admired and appreciated. 

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Matt Barrie’s Keynote Speech at the Northern Beaches Liberal Party Event

While I’ve covered much of this material in my Senate speeches, Matt masterfully brings it all together in just 1 hour and 18 minutes. He also makes a powerful point about NSW Labor’s attempts to alter voting patterns to entrench their hold on power. Sly move!

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Explicit Children’s Books Do Not Belong in Public Libraries

Every Australian child deserves to be protected from inappropriate reading material in taxpayer funded, public libraries. You have every right to have a say about what books are appropriate for your children, grandchildren, and students. 

Sign and share the petition below – closing date is 17 April – and help to make libraries safer places for our children. 

A thorough audit of libraries for “Submittable Publications” is recommended by the petitioners. Any explicit material meeting the criteria should be sent for classification review. The petition calls for a proactive approach and consistency of classification to protect children from explicit content.

It has become a growing trend in public libraries, including their online catalogues, to display books that are quite frankly designed to groom children about sex. We have the right to say this is not acceptable!

The ‘woke brigade’ are calling it book-burning. It’s not about erasing knowledge — it’s about decency and protecting children’s innocence by letting them have their childhood.

Leave our kids alone!

PETITION EN5982
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Government Doxxing Australian Companies Over Gender Pay

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It’s ironic that Labor can suddenly define what a woman is when they want to talk about a gender pay gap.

By publicly sending out information on 5000 Australian companies and claiming they’ve failed to sufficiently pay women in comparison with men, the government has maliciously misrepresented the companies and is effectively doxxing them.

The devil is in the details on this issue. Once you look closely, the myth of a gender pay gap falls apart. The report doesn’t try to compare like for like.

We don’t want a cookie cutter society inflicted on us by ‘leftist’ government bureaucracies. Differences should be celebrated. Where individuals choose to work longer hours, or choose to raise a family, these are differences that should never be ironed out by publicly shaming companies into following the Environment, Social Governance goals of the United Nations.

We need to continue to support men and women in making those different choices, especially when it comes to building a family.

One Nation rejects the divisiveness of gender politics. We support stronger families and the freedom for men and women to make their own choices about work.

Transcript

It’s ironic the Labor government are seeking to rush laws on doxxing through this parliament when they’ve just committed one of Australia’s largest doxxings. The Workplace Gender Equality Agency published a list of 5,000 businesses across Australia and detailed the wages they pay their employees. Doxxing is the act of publicly providing identifiable information about an individual or organisation, usually with malicious intent. With the release of this report, these companies have been battered in national news headlines accusing them of huge gender pay gaps. The cries of the outrage brigade have been heard across the country. They claim that these evil companies have huge gender pay gaps and that the evil patriarchy is in full control, making sure no woman in Australia will ever get paid fairly. 

Make no mistake, the private information about these companies has been published for the purpose of whacking them around in national headlines; it’s easy to see. The Workplace Gender Equality Agency report is just a roundabout way of doxxing Australian companies, and taxpayers fund the agency $11 million a year to do it. I mentioned details at the beginning of my speech, yet the one thing that’s actually missing from the report is detail. The figures don’t make a fair comparison. 

Don’t let the headlines fool you; this report is not a measure of whether a man and a woman doing the same job at the same company are paid differently. That’s been illegal for decades. The report simply takes the median of total wages and compares them. No accounting is made for whether the men and women work in different jobs or whether they are in part-time jobs. There are no adjustments for overtime or seniority—the list of exclusions goes on and on. 

If a female air steward gets paid less than the male pilot up front, the Workplace Gender Equality Agency will say that that’s a gender pay gap at that airline. The Workplace Gender Equality Agency report is one of the most oversimplified, flawed, misleading uses of statistics we’ve seen from government, and that’s saying something! If we were to truly measure the impact of sexism on wages, we would look at men and women doing the same job at the same time for the same rate. A Harvard study entitled Why do women earn less than men? Evidence from bus and train operators did exactly that. Among men and women paid the exact same rates, they found the small wage difference was entirely due to the fact that men worked 83 per cent more overtime and were twice as likely to accept a shift on short notice. Fathers were more likely than childless men to want the extra cash from overtime. Fathers working harder to provide a better life for their children and their wives—that must be the ‘toxic masculinity’ the control side of politics, the so-called Left, complains about. In short, it comes down to choice. Men and women should always have the freedom to choose how they want to work or support their family. Given the option, they will choose differently. 

Norway is considered one of the most gender equal countries in the world, yet it has some of the most extreme policies with the intention of balancing out gender differences. Despite all of the incentives, Norway still has a 17 per cent wage gap, as the Workplace Gender Equality Agency would measure it, because women still choose jobs that allow them to take care of families. 

Of course, this agency report is the brainchild of the Labor government, bent on dividing women and men for political purposes. If we’re too busy fighting each other about a gender pay gap that doesn’t actually exist, then we’re not going to pay attention to the real issues the government is sneaking through this parliament every day. The idea that women are only useful if they abandon their children and return to the workforce to be a cog in the economy is one of the greatest scams of New Age feminism. Instead of pretending everyone fits into one cookie-cutter shape, we should be acknowledging and celebrating differences. We should be supporting men and women to make the choices they want to make. We should be reforming the tax system to recognise the work that the stay-at-home parent, whether man or woman, does to build a family for the benefit of this country and for themselves. Imagine if we used some of the $14 billion a year currently subsidising day care to instead support families at home. 

One Nation will always fight for stronger supported families and for men and women to choose the work they want. Unlike the $11-million-a-year Workplace Gender Equality Agency, we’ll always reject the divisiveness of gender politics, and we will always choose to celebrate our wonderful complementary differences. 

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Slow Start on Classification System Inquiry

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I have been asking questions about books like ‘The Boys’ and ‘Welcome to Sex’ that expose young children to adult sexual concepts and behaviours. Even worse these books do so in a way that encourages and normalises child sexual behaviour. The rating system for printed works, like these graphic novels, has failed to keep pace with the appearance of the graphic novels more than 20 years ago.

A review of the classification system for written works was promised last year by the Mininster during a meeting with me and I am still waiting for that review to start. At the moment this adult cartoon content is legal to sell to a child of any age because of a loophole in the current system.

After these questions, I hope the Minister with call the review immediately. Sexual material of this nature must be at least rated MA14+, making it illegal to sell to children under 14.

Transcript

Senator ROBERTS: Thank you for appearing, Mr Sharp.  

Mr Sharp: Pleasure, Senator. 

Senator ROBERTS: In response to a question at October Senate estimates relating to the inquiry into the adequacy of the rating system, Senator Brown made this statement. I will quote: “Informal consultation with government stakeholders has commenced. Public consultation will occur early in 2024”. I subsequently received a response to my question on notice which provided the same information. It’s early in 2024 and the Classification Board website does not mention an inquiry. Has public consultation started? If not, when will it? 

Mr Sharp: Senator, I refer you to the department on that. We have been participating in the stage 1 reforms that have been passed. That legislation has been passed. The board has been consulted as part of that. Effectively, the preparation for the implementation of that is occurring. As for the stage 2, the board has no further information on when that will occur. I refer you to the department for further information. 

Senator ROBERTS: When is the review into the classification scheme going to start? Senator Brown said that it would be starting in early 2024. 

Mr Sharp: I don’t have that information, Senator. We are a key stakeholder, but that’s a decision for the minister and the department. 

Senator ROBERTS: So I have to ask the department? 

Mr Sharp: Yes, Senator. 

Senator ROBERTS: Senator Brown, you said it would start in early 2024. 

Senator Carol Brown: And it’s very early 2024. Are we talking about the second stage of the reform? 

Senator ROBERTS: The review into the classification system. 

Senator Carol Brown: The second stage of the reform will clarify the scheme’s purpose and scope and establish fit-for-purpose regulatory and governance arrangements and improve the responsiveness of the scheme to evolving community standards and expectations. I will have to take on notice any particular date. The departmental representative can answer. 

Mr Windeyer: I caught your question. Just to assist, yes, the intention is still that public consultation will kick off early this year. A precise date I don’t have, but that remains the intention. 

Senator ROBERTS: Are we talking a month or so? 

Mr Windeyer: I don’t want to put a time on it. Yes, the intention is still early this year to commence public consultation on the stage 2 reforms. 

Senator ROBERTS: In response to my question regarding the graphic novel Welcome to sex, which I described as targeted to 10-year-olds and up—the author in fact says it’s suitable for eight-year-olds and up—Ms Jolly, who I guess is your predecessor— 

Mr Sharp: Correct, Senator. 

Senator ROBERTS: responded, and I quote: Our understanding is that the book clearly states that it is targeted to teenagers from 13 up. Here is the book, which on the flyleaf identifies the reader as an ‘apprehensive 11-year-old’. Amazon still has the listing at 10 plus. I do note that Hardie Grant, the publishers, have removed reference to an age entirely, so we’re heading in the right direction. It is unhelpful, though, to potential purchasers and where other booksellers have it listed at 14 plus. Can you clarify, on notice please, Mr Sharp, what age is the Classification Board happy with— 10 plus or 14 plus—and why? 

Mr Sharp: Senator, it’s actually not the place of the board to predict what age something should be available other than through the classification process. We’ve had no applications for that book at this time and the board has not reviewed it. 

Senator ROBERTS: It’s now self-classification, I take it, since the legislation was passed. Is that correct? 

Mr Sharp: No, Senator. That’s not correct. The stage 1 reforms did not address anything to do with publications. Publications can either be submitted for classification by the publisher or they can be called in by the director if there’s a belief that it could possibly be a submittable publication. 

Senator ROBERTS: In other words, self-publication is one of the choices or submitted to the board? 

Mr Sharp: Well, it’s not self-classification, Senator. It is the publisher choosing to have the board classify it by making an application for that. Self-classification generally is referred to as them making a choice about what that classification is and publishing it in that way. Senator ROBERTS: I thought the publisher could classify it or ask the board to classify it. I thought that’s what you said. 

Mr Sharp: No. The publisher can put it forward as an application to be classified by the board, or the board can call it in separately. 

Senator ROBERTS: Thank you for clarifying. There seems to be some backside covering going on with the publishers because they’ve started to shift the age upwards slightly. In the last estimates, in response to my question about the options available to the Classification Board for graphic novels, Ms Jolly, your predecessor said, and I quote: “I think the board’s submission to the Stevens review back in 2020 was that we felt there would be benefit in having some greater graduations in classifications”. The Stevens report did not make that recommendation at all. In fact, quoting from page 66 of his report, Mr Stevens said: “On balance, I do not consider that a compelling case has been made for an additional classification category in isolation of a more fundamental look at all the categories”. Mr Sharp and Senator Brown, will you assure the committee that your work in this imminent review will provide that in-depth look at available options that supports a legally binding intermediate classification such as MA14+ or MA15+? 

Mr Sharp: Well, Senator, it’s a good question. The board does not have any input into the scope of that review. However, I can say that on the public record the board in 2020 for the Stevens review made a submission and made recommendations around publications with the idea of harmonising and aligning all the guidelines—the film, computer game and the publication—so that they are more clear in their administering and for the public to understand. Within that, the board did note that it would make sense to abolish the existing unrestricted category 1 and category 2, which really is unclear to the public, and institute possibly an M, an R18+ or an X18+, which would align to those three categories and are well understood by the public within the film classification and computer games classification. That was part of the board’s submission in 2020. The board still has a position. 

Senator ROBERTS: We think the MA14+ or MA15+ are necessary because it’s not suitable for under 14s and it is suitable for 14s and up and 15s and up. That would fit in with your M. Is that correct? 

Mr Sharp: Well, not exactly, Senator. M is not recommended for persons under 15. MA is a legally restricted classification. 

Senator ROBERTS: What does that mean? 

Mr Sharp: It means that people under 15 years cannot purchase the publication and, similarly with a film, cannot view a film unless they have an adult doing that for them. It’s not that they cannot hold it, but they cannot purchase it or buy a ticket to it themselves. So the board’s previous submission was for an M, which is an equivalent to unrestricted. Currently, you may well be aware that unrestricted can also have an additional consumer advice of not recommended for persons under 15 years. R18 would be the equivalent of a category 1 currently, and there is X18. So the intention of the board in that submission, and our position today still, is to use classification designations that the public understands, recognises and trusts very well within the film classification area and the computer game classification area. 

Senator ROBERTS: So would that mean it would not be possible for a 14-year-old or under 14 to buy this? 

Mr Sharp: It would be strongly recommended that it’s not for that age group. But it would not be legally prohibited to do so. It would be advised that a parent make a decision around that. Parental guidance is part of that process. 

Senator ROBERTS: So you are heading in what would be the right direction for me. 

Mr Sharp: I’m pleased to hear that, Senator. 

Senator ROBERTS: But that’s what it sounds like. I’m just checking. 

Mr Sharp: I believe we’re on the same page. 

Senator ROBERTS: I don’t think under 14s should be able to get this, but let’s see what happens with your review, which is imminent. 

Mr Windeyer: Correct. 

Senator ROBERTS: We’ll ask in May. 

Senator Carol Brown: There will be more to say in due course, Senator Roberts.

Senator ROBERTS: Thank you, Senator Brown. 

/by